Wishlist: Add a document layer to module footprints

[Stephen Eaton]

Wish:
I would like to see a document layer for module footprints that maps to the comment layer (or similar) in pcbnew.

Reason:
Coming from eagle I miss the ability to be able to document additional footprint information in the library module that I don't want to end up in the silkscreen layer e.g. clearance area information or full component outlines that may cover pads.

[Dick Hollenbeck (dickelbeck)]

Stephen Eaton wrote:
> Public bug reported:
>
> Wish:
> I would like to see a document layer for module footprints that maps to the comment layer (or similar) in pcbnew.
>
> Reason:
> Coming from eagle I miss the ability to be able to document additional footprint information in the library module that I don't want to end up in the silkscreen layer e.g. clearance area information or full component outlines that may cover pads.
>
> ** Affects: kicad
> Importance: Wishlist
> Status: New
>
>

Are we talking about text? You said "document" as a verb.

Would not a capability to add "fields" give you this? This would be
like the eeschema symbol, where each field can be visible or invisible.

Maybe this already exists. I see the need. I don't see the suggested
solution as the only one.

[Alain Portal (alain-portal)]

Le vendredi 11 juin 2010 11:06:15, vous avez écrit :
> Public bug reported:
>
> Wish:
> I would like to see a document layer for module footprints that maps to the
> comment layer (or similar) in pcbnew.
>
> Reason:
> Coming from eagle I miss the ability to be able to document additional
> footprint information in the library module that I don't want to end up in
> the silkscreen layer e.g. clearance area information or full component
> outlines that may cover pads.

+1

[Stephen Eaton (seaton)]

I'm talking about document as in an additional graphical layer (just like pcbnew where there is document layer) where you draw additional graphical information or have text. In eagle there are two document layers (front and back of board) for components is an additional drawing layer that does not get printed for fabrication, but is available for design time and documentation, i.e. print out the for design documentation.

For example I've used it in the past to document the component clearances around RF modules that have integrated antennas of where I can have traces, so I have my silkscreen outline of the footprint as per normal, I also have an additional outline around the footprint that don't show up in fabrication output, this shows me where not to place components and where I need to place it against a board edge, so is very useful for visually indicating where I can run tracks and place other components or anything else I need at design time..

Another example is a connector that hang over the edge of the board, the silkscreen is only useful for the actual board, but the document layer can have the rest of the outline to give you an idea of the full component dimensions. When panellising, these overhangs need to be taken into account as they interfere with neighbour panel, or may overlap another panel, but you don't want the silkscreen on the other panel.

Also for better documenting the component outlines that complement silkscreen, from the examples below you can see full component outlines that don't interfere with pads.

A couple of examples attached

[Stephen Eaton (seaton)]

other example as I can only attach a single file

[Jerry Jacobs (jerryjacobs-deactivatedaccount)]

This can be in high value for people in production which need to draw sizes of connectors and such for integrating with a casing. I think this is a other feature than a comment layer (which normaly is only used for text). Also this pops the question from my mind if pcbnew is able to add/remove/move up/move down layers on the layer stack. Then people can make the choice how they organise layers themself and how they give them names.

[Stephen Eaton (seaton)]

I like the idea of adding removing layers, or maybe have a 1:1 layer mapping to that of pcbnew?

[Stephen Eaton (seaton)]

Whilst creating some modules today I found that this feature is already implemented, you can map a graphic to any of the existing pcbnew layers. However it's hidden under under the context menu in the module editor.

When adding a graphic to the module by default it's on the silkscreen layer, if you right click on the graphic | edit | edit layer (current), then edit you can assign it to any of the other layers. However this process needs to occur for each segment you want on different layers.

To make this more intuitive I think the module editor needs the layer manager to be displayed with the same functionality as PCBnew, i.e. selecting layer before starting to draw, or turning layers display on/off.

[hauptmech (hauptmech)]

Here is a small use case from my usage of KiCAD.

I keep 2 types of graphical info for footprints; courtyards (a recommended boundary for placement) and footprint outlines (showing the physical dimensions of the part and it's pins for when I need to place things close to each other).

At the moment all my footprints are generated via scripts because the module editor is otherwise unusable.

Courtyards go on the comments layer
Part outlines go on the drawings layer
0,0 is the part center for assembly purposes.

----

The main problem I have is that I need to hide these details for one side or the other but not both; and this is not possible.

A drawings front/drawings back, Comments front/comments back set of layers might work.

Even better would be a module specific layer that the renderer can draw or not depending on the side the footprint is sitting.

[Lorenzo Marcantonio (l-marcantonio)]

On Sun, 21 Aug 2011, hauptmech wrote:

> The main problem I have is that I need to hide these details for one
> side or the other but not both; and this is not possible.
>
> A drawings front/drawings back, Comments front/comments back set of
> layers might work.
>
> Even better would be a module specific layer that the renderer can draw
> or not depending on the side the footprint is sitting.

That's a known issue... I have too the same problem (need another pair of front/back paired drawing layers).

The problem is that, for now, pcbnew is hardcoded for 32 layers and their relationship is hardcoded too. There was someone months ago who worked on a more flexible layer structure but I don't know how it was...

An interim 'simple' solution would be to 'requisite' the Eco1/Eco2 layers as an additional front/back pair... simple is between quotes since the front/back relationship isn't really all coded in one place...

I'd say, one more vote for this in the wishlist!

--
Lorenzo Marcantonio
Logos Srl

[madworm (madworm-de-inkscape)]

Would this also include a milling / routing layer ?

Say some part needs a cutout / slot underneath it. Doing that in pcbnew again and again would suck. Currently one can only draw lines on the silkscreen and later change the layer in a text editor.

[sugeng anto (anthos1984)]

can we have "custom" fields from eeschema get transferred to pcbnew ?
As I know, current build (BZR3762) only transfers "reference" and "value" field.

For example, I have 2 LEDs. Called D1 and D2. D1 = red, D2 = green. I want to mark D1 as POWER, and D2 as BUSY. It will shown on document layer on PCB (part of silkscreen).
It is bad to change the "reference", it must be kept as D1 and D2.
Also the "value" shows the part number (different number = different color), so I can't change it.
So the one I needs to change is "custom" field with POWER and BUSY.

current build :
1. the text is not moving with the part. Must be moved individually since it created manually using graphic text.
2. If the text in eeschema changed, the one in pcbnew isn't changed.

thanks

[hauptmech (hauptmech)]

I understand your desire to keep synchronized meta-data between
schematic and pcb. And it seems natural that once you are able to do
that you would be 'show' a piece of meta data on the board.

Anyway, the work-around is to put the text on the board manually as you
have been doing, rather than using the custom fields and trying to keep
them synchronized.

Not a bug until it becomes a feature... :)

On 11/01/2012 02:27 AM, sugeng anto wrote:
> can we have "custom" fields from eeschema get transferred to pcbnew ?
> As I know, current build (BZR3762) only transfers "reference" and "value" field.
>
> For example, I have 2 LEDs. Called D1 and D2. D1 = red, D2 = green. I want to mark D1 as POWER, and D2 as BUSY. It will shown on document layer on PCB (part of silkscreen).
> It is bad to change the "reference", it must be kept as D1 and D2.
> Also the "value" shows the part number (different number = different color), so I can't change it.
> So the one I needs to change is "custom" field with POWER and BUSY.
>
> current build :
> 1. the text is not moving with the part. Must be moved individually since it created manually using graphic text.
> 2. If the text in eeschema changed, the one in pcbnew isn't changed.
>
> thanks
>