Comment 33 for bug 84958

@Ralf Nieuwenhuijsen

"I guess most developpers won't have the patience of jhansonxi to argue and would just put the bug on 'wont fix'."

I'm not a developer. I just posted the *.desktop files I created for my users and posted them here. The MOTU team decided they were worth adding.

"I've tried making a case for a clean menu. But i never actually get the feeling my argument got accross. I keep getting technical explenations of stuff I already understand. Which to me seems completely irrelevant."

You keep posting irrelevant comparisons to scenarios which almost never occur in practice. The following is a perfect example:

" - installing firefox, java and windows-media-player on wine.
 - you end up with a [firefox launcher, a java configuration tool, a java update tool] in the wine menu
 - in the system -> confiugration menu you end up with a [a wine configuration tool, java configuration tool]
 - you already had a firefox link in the internet menu"

Since when would any Linux user do this if native versions of the same apps are already available? Wouldn't it be easier to just install Windows?

"Now ask this theoretical user the following questions:
  - which java configuration tools configures which java and affects which browsers?"
  - what is the difference between the two firefoxes?
  - why does a .wmv correctly open in applications -> tools -> Wine File Browser?
  - why does the same .wmv not correctly open when you open it from your home-folder?
  - if you go to applications -> system -> software uninstaller .. which of the two firefoxes do you uninstall?
  - if you go to applications -> add/remove .. which of the two firefoxes do you uninstall?"

If a user chooses to complicate their life by installing redundant applications then whose problem is that?

"But please don't come with techincal reasons, analogies with java or how wine is just a document-viewer."

These are prefect examples of how menu items alone do not dictate a user's pattern of usage with an application. You keep trying to box them into specific categories but it's not possible.

"You also don't have to educate me about the technical details. I am quite aware of why it is, like it is. (I work as linux system administrator, and install ubuntu on about 30+ different workplaces of about 5 different clients of mine, not counting the servers)."

Your technical background is irrelevant. Your argument needs to stand on it's own merits. I don't care if you are the Pope.

My user's aren't going to care if the menu items are combined in a Wine sub-menu or not. They proven to not be that stupid. Some better desktop integration is desirable and we've come up with a few here. Probably need to submit a few more bug/feature requests and try to get the MOTU and Wine teams to implement them.