Space calculation passes, but out of space crash later

[J C Nash]

Binary package hint: update-manager

Initial attempt to use Breezy -> Dapper "upgrade" button in update manager said there was not enough space on my disk. Cleaned out a lot of junk, and then it worked --- ALMOST. Got to very end of install, doing writes of config files, when the terminal msgs said "out of space" as steps failed. Left system in a mess. Got install to work by merging 2 partitions and trashing another OS.

May be related to bug 9459, which seems to suggest similar issues.

JN

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

Thanks for your bugreport.

Could you please attach the files from /var/log/dist-upgrade*.log to this bugreport? That will give me a better idea what went wrong.

[J C Nash (nashjc)]

The problem is that the config files were being written when it crashed
and the machine was unbootable in Ubuntu, though WinXP was still
available. I deleted the partition (I use Knoppix for this sort of
thing, mainly because I am familiar with its tools, though Dapper CD has
similar tools), and another partition to create space in a new merged
primary partition, then the install went OK from CD. Thus the files were
toasted. Perhaps I should have used Knoppix to try to find the log
files, but since they were likely unflushed, and unflushable, probably
would not have helped. Running out of space really is nuisance because
you lose not only the functionality but also the record of its loss.
I've a number of war stories that are much worse than this from that
perspective. (I built my first machine in 1962).

Pretty certain the problem is that the space estimation was a bit low.
It was "writing config files" and showed 99% completion on the status
graph when "disk full" errors started appearing. I had a bit over 3G on
the partition at the time, but had installed some extra s/w in Breezy.
Maybe that extra s/w was not being counted. Or the many updates to
packages had added enough space to put things over the top. I should
mention that my initial try of the "Upgrade" button on upgrade manager
did say I needed to free space, which I did. On the subsequent try no
complaints. Clearly not quite enough space though.

If it is the space calculation, and no obvious bugs, it may be simplest
to put in a bigger allowance for fudge, and close the bug report. The
bug is important mainly because it can trash a system. Telling someone
to get more space is temporarily annoying, but does no damage. Disk
settings (block sizes) can really make significant system-system
differences in space requirements for the same set of files. Truthfully
I've not even checked what my system is using, as space is not usually a
problem, and allowing for super-tight packing is not a great idea.

Cheers,

JN
Pres. Ottawa Canada Linux User Group

PS System seems to be running fine. I now have 4 machines running
Dapper. One other was also a raw install. One upgrade on another machine
gave no problems. The 3rd machine was upgraded from the CD following
instructions found on the website, as for some reason the "Upgrade
dist." button did not get presented, just a msg that a distribution
upgrade was available. Things went OK, though there was more manual
intervention with that machine to set sources etc.

Michael Vogt wrote:
> Thanks for your bugreport.
>
> Could you please attach the files from /var/log/dist-upgrade*.log to
> this bugreport? That will give me a better idea what went wrong.
>
> ** Changed in: update-manager (Ubuntu)
> Importance: Untriaged => High
> Assignee: (unassigned) => Michael Vogt
> Status: Unconfirmed => Needs Info
>

--
John C. Nash, School of Management, University of Ottawa,
Vanier Hall 451, 136 Jean-Jacques Lussier Private,
P.O. Box 450, Stn A, Ottawa, Ontario, K1N 6N5 Canada
email: nashjc on mail server uottawa.ca, voice mail: 613 562 5800 X 4796
fax [phone], Web URL = http://macnash.admin.uottawa.ca
"Pra...

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

Thanks a lot for your detailed explaination!

Just one question. Did you install all into a single parition? Or did you paritioned it in a way to have "/" seperate from e.g. "/var" (or some other setup)?

Thanks,
 Michael

P.S. I'm impressed how long you are already in the computers field :)

[J C Nash (nashjc)]

The machine has 4 partitions, but Ubuntu is all in one for the Linux
stuff. i.e., all but the /media mount points were on one partition.
hda1 is C: and hda5 is D: in the MS terminology. I set these up
as FAT32 when I put on XP Pro soon after getting the machine in order
that Linux would be able to read and write them. I used to have 2 Linux
partitions (one primary, one logical), but after the crash of this bug
report, I combined them. One was Ubuntu Breezy, in process of upgrade at
crash, and one was Xandros 3.02, since sacrificed. Sorry that I don't
remember which was the logical one. I really should have recorded that,
and it may be buried somewhere in my log books.

Partition structure is a bit messy, having evolved over the 3.5 years.

                                  cfdisk 2.12r

                               Disk Drive: /dev/hda
                         Size: 40007761920 bytes, 40.0 GB
               Heads: 255 Sectors per Track: 63 Cylinders: 4864

     Name Flags Part Type FS Type [Label] Size (MB)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
hda1 Boot Primary W95 FAT32 (LBA) 14151.36*
                      Logical Free Space 0.04*
hda5 NC Logical W95 FAT32 19506.47*
hda3 Primary Linux ext3 [ubuntu] 5996.23
hda4 Primary Linux swap / Solaris 353.69

Some partition programs show hda2 as the extended partition. As far as I
recall, the .04 MB "free space" was not usable and may be overhead.

As you may have gathered, I was using this machine as a testbed for
ideas, and a "show and tell" box when I go to conferences, though it may
be a signpost that it hasn't been booted in XP for quite a while and
Ubuntu has been moved to top of Grub menu.

JN

Michael Vogt wrote:
> Thanks a lot for your detailed explaination!
>
> Just one question. Did you install all into a single parition? Or did
> you paritioned it in a way to have "/" seperate from e.g. "/var" (or
> some other setup)?
>
> Thanks,
> Michael
>
>
> P.S. I'm impressed how long you are already in the computers field :)
>

--
John C. Nash, School of Management, University of Ottawa,
Vanier Hall 451, 136 Jean-Jacques Lussier Private,
P.O. Box 450, Stn A, Ottawa, Ontario, K1N 6N5 Canada
email: nashjc on mail server uottawa.ca, voice mail: 613 562 5800 X 4796
fax [phone], Web URL = http://macnash.admin.uottawa.ca
"Practical Forecasting for Managers" web site is at
http://www.arnoldpublishers.com/support/nash/

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

Thanks for this additinal information. This is all I needed. I wanted to be sure that the complete install was done on a single parition. I incoreased the savety buffer for now and will try to reproduce the crash on a testsystem system with a small parition.

Cheers,
 Michael

[J C Nash (nashjc)]

Thanks. Likely fine to be a bit cautious and ensure there is plenty of
space. Disks are fairly cheap and I've spent far too much time playing
"fit it in" games over the years. Folk get more upset over crashes than
being told to get more disk.

Cheers, JN

Michael Vogt wrote:
> Thanks for this additinal information. This is all I needed. I wanted to
> be sure that the complete install was done on a single parition. I
> incoreased the savety buffer for now and will try to reproduce the crash
> on a testsystem system with a small parition.
>
> Cheers,
> Michael
>

--
John C. Nash, School of Management, University of Ottawa,
Vanier Hall 451, 136 Jean-Jacques Lussier Private,
P.O. Box 450, Stn A, Ottawa, Ontario, K1N 6N5 Canada
email: nashjc on mail server uottawa.ca, voice mail: 613 562 5800 X 4796
fax [phone], Web URL = http://macnash.admin.uottawa.ca
"Practical Forecasting for Managers" web site is at
http://www.arnoldpublishers.com/support/nash/

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

I mark this as fixed released because the current version of the dist-upgrader has a bigger safety buffer that should be enough now.