network-manager doesn't handle ppp connections.

[Alexandre Fiori]

Hi.

I think that there's little confusion while talking about bugs in firefox, evolution and pidgin regarding the "offline mode".
After reading tons of posts related to such bugs, I decided to open this new ticket and post my point of view, trying to clarify what's happening, and why.
Some of the bugs are:
#191889
#116696
#147119
#177763
#212710
#220007

Also, there's a post from Dan William about these problems of network-manager not handling your connection (especially on Ubuntu):
http://blogs.gnome.org/dcbw/category/networkmanager/

Actually, network-manager can be considered a good thing. Not only because it's integrated with standardized applications such as freedesktop's dbus and hal, but it's also a way to make third-part applications (such as firefox, evolution and pidgin) know the network status no matter what distro you use.
According to the Network Manager website, www.gnome.org/projects/NetworkManager, it helps on application integration - few years ago I was totally against it, but now I understand that it's really needed in order to make distros and programs as much compatible as possible.

The fact is that NM < 0.7 doesn't handle any kind of connection - at least on gutsy, it doesn't handle, for instance, ppp connections. I'm currently using ppp connection for my hsdpa, and, as my provider doesn't require APN, I'm using NM's manual configuration. I start and stop the connection through the "Dial Up Connections" on the applet. It makes no difference from using the applet or wvdial, it completely ignores the ppp connection, and, because of that, I cannot use NM to start any of my PPTP VPNs.
Well, I know the workaround by setting DHCP or static IP addres, but that's not what I want - and most of us.

Also, many programmers are just following a standard (thanks god) when they set the "offline mode" in their application, according to dbus messages. It cannot be considered a "firefox bug", or "pidgin bug". Instead, we should really thank that our system is getting as much standardized as possible.

So, I would like to say that if hardy isn't going to be shipped with NM 0.7, you should consider using older versions (no!) of programs that doesn't depend on dbus messages, or else provide us a way (with another patch to NM) to set the network status by hand, no matter what kind of connection we're using.
I believe that without such feature, it's going to be a disaster.

[Darryl Moore (darryl-moores)]

The short comings of network manager could easily be overcome if the applications that use it could be configured to ignore it.

Firefox should have a switch in about:config so that it can always start online.

[Alexandre Fiori (fiorix)]

How about the lack of ability to manage ppp and other non-eth connections? Without that we cannot use VPNs configured through NM since we're "offline". How about all the other applications such as evolution and pidgin? How about the new applications to come?
As I wrote, programmers of third-part software have nothing to do with it, they are just following the standard.
If the ubuntu team REALLY thinks it's not related to network-manager, please remove it and make ALL applications work without it.

[Simone Tolotti (simontol)]

I agree with alef13. You need to write on the ubuntu.com homepage : "If you don't have an ethernet connection, please don't download Ubuntu Hardy, go for another distro please!" I'm ironic, but this is the sad truth...

[Luca Ottaviano (blackbudda)]

I strongly agree with both Simone and alef13.
The question is: why I have to explain my parents that they have to uncheck "offline mode" in Firefox to surf the web? After all, Ubuntu is Linux for human beings! This is not going to be good marketing for a LTS version.
My take is defer the release until everything is working (almost) flawlessy. After all, some delay for a LTS version is not going to hurt (IMO).

[reech (r-mcmillan)]

Can confirm this in HH final version here (after having FF trouble). I really don't think this is desirable behaviour.

[Dave Vree (hdave)]

I also can confirm this in Hardy Final. It uses NM 0.6.6 and even after I use the applet to successfully connect via ppp0 (via evdo verizon wireless) it still reports I am offline.

Does anyone know when NM 0.7 will be generally available (Gnome 2.24 in October?). Is there a development build we can start testing?

[EliotBlennerhassett (eliot-blennerhassett)]

I have just been setting up a friend's old PC that only uses modem for 'network'. Initially NM showed "No network devices found" and I needed to do the manual setup as describe earlier.

However, as I have a network here, I temporarily installed an ethernet adapter in the machine to facilitate the big post-install package upgrades.

Then (maybe after a reboot?) in addition to "(o) Wired network" showing up in NM, I also have "Dial Up Connections", with pop-out menu "Connect to ppp0 via Modem, Disconnect from ppp0 via Modem"

After removing the ethernet adapter again, the Dial Up menu item is gone again :(

[tz (thomas-mich)]

And NM is completely broke for EVDO modems.

I have a Pantech with Verizon service. It is fully recognized at /dev/ttyACM0.

NM demands a username although it is not used. (stupidmode=on for wvdial)

Even if I type all the stuff in correctly, NM refuses to dial and/or connect.

There is no help which might explain a fix.

This sort-of worked in feisty, at least whatever combination would actually dial and connect to an EVDO modem.

[Alexandre Fiori (fiorix)]

That's one of a thousand reasons I decided to quit linux on desktop. After buying a macbook, I have almost the same features, without stupid issues and lack of basic functionality.
Now, I only use ubuntu where it works better: the server.

[Alexander Sack (asac)]

fixed by NM 0.7 (intrepid)

[pabouk (pabouk)]

I am using Interpid with Network Manager 0.7 but NM does not allow me to manage dialup connections. I do not see Dialup connections or ppp in NM at all. If I start a ppp connection the normal way using pppd it is not recognized by NM and I cannot use VPN connections in NM.

[Alexander Sack (asac)]

NM handles pppoe and mobile broadband which covers about 98% of the use-cases. Nobody stepped up to build in plain modem support ... contributions welcome.