[upstream] Improve the wording of "Paste Special" options

Bug #1423034 reported by Amr Ibrahim
6
This bug affects 1 person
Affects Status Importance Assigned to Milestone
LibreOffice
Fix Released
Wishlist
libreoffice (Ubuntu)
Fix Released
Wishlist
Unassigned

Bug Description

When I copy a group of cells in Calc and then I choose "Paste Special" from the toolbar in either Calc or Writer, I get these terms that a normal user may not understand.
In Calc: GDI metafile, PNG Bitmap, Bitmap, calc8, DDE link, DIF
In Writer: the same as in Calc

Revision history for this message
Björn Michaelsen (bjoern-michaelsen) wrote :

This bug need to clearly define how to describe the options instead. Also please consider filing this one upstream.

Changed in libreoffice (Ubuntu):
importance: Undecided → Wishlist
status: New → Incomplete
Revision history for this message
In , Amr Ibrahim (amribrahim1987) wrote :

When I copy a group of cells in Calc and then I choose "Paste Special" from the toolbar in either Calc or Writer, I get these terms that a normal user may not understand.

In Calc: GDI metafile, PNG Bitmap, Bitmap, calc8, DDE link, DIF

In Writer: the same as in Calc

The titles should be more descriptive. There are also two Bitmap options in Calc, which adds more confusion.

summary: - Improve the wording of "Paste Special" options
+ [upstream] Improve the wording of "Paste Special" options
Changed in df-libreoffice:
importance: Unknown → Wishlist
status: Unknown → New
Changed in libreoffice (Ubuntu):
status: Incomplete → New
Revision history for this message
In , Stgohi-lobugs (stgohi-lobugs) wrote :

Reproducible with LO 4.4.0.3, Win 8.1.

This is really not intuitive if you are not used to it. The currently available online help does also not help. These options should be explained in the LO help. I for instance do not have any idea what "calc8" means.
Is it also maybe possible to add tooltips in such a dialogue box to explain the entries?

Steps Done:
1. Open CALC
2. Select any cell and press CTRL + C
3. Open a new document in WRITER
4. Go to EDIT -> PASTE SPECIAL in the WRITER document

Changed in df-libreoffice:
status: New → Confirmed
Revision history for this message
In , Amr Ibrahim (amribrahim1987) wrote :

Please, someone from Design takes a look at this bug.

Revision history for this message
In , Vstuart-foote (vstuart-foote) wrote :

Well, it is a valid issue. The "paste special" list is correct as to the object type that would be pasted--but it is not very intuitive as to just what the object represents.

Implement a translatable and human "friendly" labeling for each--not sure if a tooltip might also be possible, but if so that would help.

Back to UI

Revision history for this message
In , Amr Ibrahim (amribrahim1987) wrote :

For the sake of completeness, improve all the paste options in all LO components.

Paste options in Draw: Draw 8, Drawing format, GDI metafile, Bitmap

Revision history for this message
In , Aron Budea (baron-z) wrote :

Thanks for pointing to this report, Timur.
In bug 101818 Marco brought up MS's variant of this (see sketch at [1]), and I argued for having a novice/expert view of the dialog, one would be straightforward and convenient to use even for new users, and the other would show all the choices the Paste Special dialog currently has (wording should still be improved there of course).

[1] https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=127096

Revision history for this message
In , Yousuf 'Jay' Philips (philipz85) wrote :

The format strings are defined in the below file, so it really just comes down to us deciding what the new strings should say.

http://opengrok.libreoffice.org/xref/core/svtools/source/dialogs/formats.src

@Eike, @Maxim: Your input on this would be appreciated.

(In reply to Aron Budea from comment #5)
> In bug 101818 Marco brought up MS's variant of this (see sketch at [1]), and
> I argued for having a novice/expert view of the dialog, one would be
> straightforward and convenient to use even for new users, and the other
> would show all the choices the Paste Special dialog currently has (wording
> should still be improved there of course).

As novice users dont use the dialog or the split button part of the paste toolbar button, as they simply click the main part of the paste button in the toolbar or Ctrl+V, there doesnt need to be modes for the dialog. What the dialog does need is a label description under the selection list that details what the type of option can be used for, similar to the one found in the Tools > Customize dialog.

Revision history for this message
In , Aron Budea (baron-z) wrote :

(In reply to Yousuf Philips (jay) from comment #6)
> As novice users dont use the dialog or the split button part of the paste
> toolbar button, as they simply click the main part of the paste button in
> the toolbar or Ctrl+V, there doesnt need to be modes for the dialog. What

Disagree. Just because it says "special," pasting clipboard unformatted is still very common functionality.

Also, needsDevEval is for easy hacks.

Revision history for this message
In , Yousuf 'Jay' Philips (philipz85) wrote :

(In reply to Aron Budea from comment #7)
> Disagree. Just because it says "special," pasting clipboard unformatted is
> still very common functionality.

Never stated pasting clipboard unformatted isnt common, which is why it is in the context menu and an entry in the Edit menu. Other paste special options arent common which is why they arent visible in these places.

> Also, needsDevEval is for easy hacks.

Yes the design team sets "needsDevEval, topicUI" to request a design dev to look into what skills are needed and whether its a easy hack.

Revision history for this message
In , Aron Budea (baron-z) wrote :

You're right, my mistake.

Revision history for this message
In , Amr Ibrahim (amribrahim1987) wrote :

Any news on this?

Revision history for this message
In , Amr Ibrahim (amribrahim1987) wrote :

*** Bug 101818 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Revision history for this message
In , Yousuf 'Jay' Philips (philipz85) wrote :

Maxim, Eike, Miklos, UX-Team: Would you recommend changing the format names[1] to make them more understandable within the listbox and/or to defined these formats in help[2] and show these definitions within the dialog (similar to MS[3]).

The benefit of improving the listbox labels is that the improvement will also be visible in the toolbar split button. The benefit of defining these formats in help is that we can have sentence long descriptions for each format.

[1] http://opengrok.libreoffice.org/xref/core/sot/source/base/exchange.cxx#59
[2] https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Paste_Special
[3] http://www.msoffice-tutorial-training.com/images/excel-t19-pic4.gif

Revision history for this message
In , Tietze-heiko (tietze-heiko) wrote :

Microsoft does the trick with a long static tooltip below the list of options like "Insert the content of the clipboard as a bitmap picture. This format can take up a lot of memory and disc space, but is exactly what you see on the screen". Hard to imagine that we find a similar appropriate text that is shorter. But lets try:

GDI metafile - Screen optimized bitmap (GDI)
PNG Bitmap - Cross-plattform optimized bitmap (PNG)
Bitmap - Compatibility optimized bitmap [Remark: is that true?]
calc8 - Calc object [Remark: what's the difference to standard paste operation?]
DDE link - Reference only (DDE link)
DIF - Paste text using standardized formats (DIF)
Unformatted text - Paste plain text
Formatted text [RTF] - Paste with formattings (RTF)
Formatted text [Richtext] - Paste with formattings (Richtext) [Remark: What's the difference between "RTF"=Rich formatted text and "Richtext"?]
HTML (HyperText Markup Panguage) - Paste with web formatting (HTML)
Star Object Descriptor (XML) - Backward compatibility object (SOD XML)

[Remark: Today we have an awkward mixture of brackets)

Adding Olivier for input from documentation team.

Revision history for this message
In , Cno (cno) wrote :

Does the HELP button link to appropriate explanation?

Revision history for this message
In , Amr Ibrahim (amribrahim1987) wrote :

Ping! Any progress here?

Revision history for this message
In , Mikekaganski (mikekaganski) wrote :

(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #13)
> ...
> calc8 - Calc object [Remark: what's the difference to standard paste
> operation?]

Regarding the cited line from Heiko's comment: one of the formats is the default one chosen when user pastes normally (Ctrl+V). It would help to see the "(default)" after the format that is selected that way (see e.g. bug 116685 where the default for one operation is discussed).

Revision history for this message
In , Mikekaganski (mikekaganski) wrote :

Also I'd say Heiko please just do the change, it might be fine-tuned later.

Revision history for this message
In , Tietze-heiko (tietze-heiko) wrote :

Created attachment 141061
New dialog content

Patch at https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/c/52336/

Revision history for this message
In , Cno (cno) wrote :

(In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #13)

> GDI metafile - Screen optimized bitmap (GDI)

Isn't that misleading, reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Metafile ?
It is basically a vector format, designed for Windows, Windows EMF, that allows for using the Windows GDI, Graphical Device Interface?

(In reply to Mike Kaganski from comment #17)
> Also I'd say Heiko please just do the change, it might be fine-tuned later.

+1

Revision history for this message
In , Tietze-heiko (tietze-heiko) wrote :

Created attachment 141074
Paste Special dialog on Windows

(In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #19)
> > GDI metafile - Screen optimized bitmap (GDI)
>
> Isn't that misleading, reading
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Metafile ?
> It is basically a vector format, designed for Windows, Windows EMF, that
> allows for using the Windows GDI, Graphical Device Interface?

Windows has no similar entry, and spelling full is not much informative, IMHO.

Following https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Metafile "Essentially, a WMF file stores a list of function calls that have to be issued to the Windows Graphics Device Interface (GDI) layer to display an image on screen." it's kind of screen-optimized image. Alternative perhaps "Windows vector format (GDI metafile)", but is that really better?

Revision history for this message
In , Mikekaganski (mikekaganski) wrote :

Please note that the improvement should not disable interoperability: user needs to be able to see similar/familiar strings from other applications. Even if something looks "incomprehensible", it's actually less issue than "easy-to-understand" name that doesn't ring a bell to user that saw it multiple times in other apps with a different name. Actually, for an average user, no text would be easy enough. But familiarity, and also googleability are of importance. So - please also use usual names (maybe in parentheses after improved string).

Revision history for this message
In , Tietze-heiko (tietze-heiko) wrote :

Comment on attachment 141061
New dialog content

New patch with just <fullname> (<shortname>) in preparation. The format explanation should go into the documentation. See also http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Terminology-modifications-to-Paste-Special-format-tt4237242.html

Revision history for this message
In , Libreoffice-commits (libreoffice-commits) wrote :

heiko tietze committed a patch related to this issue.
It has been pushed to "master":

http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/core/commit/?id=a2f7eb5f8ea7f3ae50aea72de8b15c3364493285

tdf#89453 - Improve the wording of "Paste Special" options

It will be available in 6.1.0.

The patch should be included in the daily builds available at
http://dev-builds.libreoffice.org/daily/ in the next 24-48 hours. More
information about daily builds can be found at:
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Testing_Daily_Builds

Affected users are encouraged to test the fix and report feedback.

Changed in df-libreoffice:
status: Confirmed → Fix Released
Changed in libreoffice (Ubuntu):
status: New → Fix Released
To post a comment you must log in.
This report contains Public information  
Everyone can see this information.

Other bug subscribers

Remote bug watches

Bug watches keep track of this bug in other bug trackers.