hcid coupled with dbus

[danmb]

Binary package hint: bluez-utils

hcid exits immediately if dbus isn't running. I like running my system with dbus stopped, for various reasons (e.g. memory consumption, the fact that dbus reconfigures my ethernet interfaces disregarding in /etc/network/interfaces etc)

Please decouple hcid from dbus (and, more generally, Bluetooth from Gnome and KDE). There are plenty of people who will never run dbus, gnome, or kde. For some reason I see the advice "if you run gnome there is ..." all over the net, as if that were a practical solution.

[Marcel Holtmann (holtmann)]

If you are not running D-Bus, then you can't use Bluetooth. Period.

And btw. D-Bus is _not_ reconfiguring your network devices. NetworkManager is doing this.

[danmb (danmbox)]

"Period"? Why -- because this is the right thing to do, technically, or because it's a good way to put down users? Oh well, I guess I'll never win a confrontation with you, so never mind.

And btw. Whenever I "/etc/init.d/dbus start" my eth0 gets reconfigured. I've never touched NetworkManager.

[Marcel Holtmann (holtmann)]

Period, because the decision to use D-Bus as inter-process communication for Bluetooth has been made a long time ago. This means it is a purely technical decision. And yes, I am not even going to argue about it. There is no other sane way except you wanna live in the stone age of Unix operating systems. Same as HAL is using D-Bus and other core services of a modern Linux operating system.

Have a look at /etc/dbus-1/event.d/ for a change. Don't blame D-Bus that it re-configures your Ethernet devices. That is simply plain wrong. D-Bus is only a inter-process communication standard used by many application and services. That it is configured to automatically start NetworkManager is _not_ a D-Bus problem. D-Bus is not doing anything except inter-process communication.

[danmb (danmbox)]

I've tried to look into /etc/dbus-1/ in the past. It doesn't look like it's meant for human consumption. And I see no indication to NetworkManager in there.

Thus far I've been able to steer clear of the "services" and "applications" that rely on dbus, but I guess not anymore. In case you're not aware, Ubuntu is used as a minimalist distro in some circles (like Arch and others). Minimalist still means being able to access all devices.

[Marcel Holtmann (holtmann)]

If you wanna use Bluetooth then you have to use D-Bus. However minimalist doesn't mean that you can't have D-Bus. Actually D-Bus itself is really small. As mentioned before, it is only a simple inter-process communication protocol.

Actually with all applications using D-Bus to communicate with each other. The distro would also become more minimalist since no one needs to invent their own communication protocols all over again.