Hello Fabien.

In testing process.




2013/4/15 Fabien (Open ERP) <email address hidden>

> Daniel,
>
> Here is a presentation about the "Why" we did that change:
>   http://bit.ly/17eMp8F
>
>
Can you share the source to translate  it please?.

Thanks.



> If not about social aspects.
> It's because it better reflects the real life.
>
>
> On 04/15/2013 03:54 PM, Daniel Reis (SECURITAS SA) wrote:
> > It seems to me that the central issue is the "change in granularity
> level".
> > There are a lot of qualified people discussing the what, where & how,
> but it seems that the WHY is yet to be explained.
> >
> > Why "contact" is to be "the right level of granularity"?
> > ========================================================
> >
> > WHY the change?
> > What's OpenERP's reasoning behind this?
> >
> > I've been trying to read their mind, and I decided to contribute to the
> discussion because I think I've figured it out.
> > For me the key was in Fabien's comment #120 (
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/openobject-addons/+bug/1160365/comments/120).
> >
> > V7 is about Social:
> >>From a legal POV, your company interacts with other Companies.
> >>From a social POV, your users interact with other Company's people.
> >
> > For OpenERP to be social, it needs to interact with a Contact@Partnerinstead of a "pure" Partner.
> > This way it can send emails to Contact@Partner, instead of Partner's
> generic e-mail,
> > or let Contact@Partner interact using a personal Portal user account,
> instead of a Partner generic one.
> >
> > Thus the need for the "change in granularity".
> >
> > Everyone is assuming that a Contact it's a Person working for a Company
> > But it's not - it's more like a Job/Position at a Company.
> > It's a "Contact@Partner": a Contact *at a* Partner; a Partner plus a
> point of contact info.
> > It's actually just a face, an alias, for the Partner.
> >
> > But it breaks the commercial entity reference on documents?
> > Not in the simple, flat, partner structure you get out-of-the box on v7:
> > On the flat structure Partner 1->N Contacts, you just need to use
> `partner_id.parent_id`
> > where you used `partner_id` and there you are: you get exactly the same
> info as before.
> > This can also be easily achieved in SQL with just as additional join.
> >
> > Explained like this, it looks like, despite being a big change, there
> seems to be no big deal,
> > and that you can do everything you could do before with pretty much the
> same effort.
> >
> > And if the your ContactX@Customer1 person goes to work at Customer2,
> you don't edit Contact1:
> > You inactivate ContactX@Customer1 and create ContactX@Customer2!
> > Because "ContactX" does not make sense on itself on the new model.
> > It only makes sense to have "ContactX@Customer1" and "ContactX@Customer2
> ".
> > And if the ContactX personally is also your Customer, then you need to
> also create "HomeAddress@PersonX".
> >
> > Do I sound like Fabien and Olivier right now? I hope I do.
> >
> > Problems came when you were able to mix "Contacts at Partners" and "Pure
> Partners"
> > on the same field, and that a lot of v7 localization ports to v7 was
> done assuming that
> > partner_id is still a company ... and when you need to add a hierarchy
> to the Partner table ...
> > But that's the already discussion going on .
> >
> > I hope I contributed to a better discussion.
> > I'm not swimming in VC funding over here to offer a case, but I promise
> to bring a couple of Port wine bottles
> > to the OpenERP days if a solution good enough for everyone is achieved.
> >
> >
> > PS: Raphael's code was just a proof of concept for a solution.
> > Everyone, including Raphael, prefers a solution from OpenERP SA
> implemented directly in the core.
> > OpenERP SA should be thankful to have such an involved community, with
> people as skilled as Raphael.
> > Having said that, Raphael - I want a bottle from that case.
> >
>
>
> --
> Fabien Pinckaers
> CEO OpenERP
> Chaussée de Namur 40
> B-1367 Grand-Rosière
> Belgium
> Phone: +32.81.81.37.00
> Fax: +32.81.73.35.01
> Web: http://openerp.com
>
> --
> You received this bug notification because you are subscribed to OpenERP
> Project Group.
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1160365
>
> Title:
>   [7.0] incorrect handling of contact/companies for invoicing and
>   related purposes
>
> Status in OpenERP Addons (modules):
>   In Progress
> Status in OpenERP Server:
>   In Progress
>
> Bug description:
>   == Problem Description ==
>
>   This issue is an attempt to formalize the various problems detected
>   with the res.partner refactoring that took place in OpenERP 7.0. Some
>   of the issues have already been discussed on bug 1151947, bug 1155679
>   and on help.openerp.com.
>
>   The main problems identified so far:
>
>   1) When a simple contact (type=contact) is selected as the reference
>   party for creating a business document (such as the customer on a
>   Sales Order), a proper invoicing partner (if any) should be selected
>   among the descendants of the "commercial party" to which the contact
>   belongs, instead of the contact itself.
>
>   2) Even when a simple contact is used as the invoicing partner for a
>   business operation (e.g. manually selected by the user as the invoice
>   address on a SO), all invoicing/accounting-related master data must be
>   taken from the relevant "commercial party" for that contact. This will
>   usually be the parent company.
>
>   3) When editing contacts/addresses, it is currently possible to view
>   and edit accounting/invoicing related data, while it should be clear
>   that this data is coming from the "related commercial party", usually
>   the parent company.
>
>   4) When searching though business documents for a company name, the
>   entries that were issued for one of the company's contacts/addresses
>   should be found as well.
>
>   5) It has been reported that in some countries it is not permitted to
>   issue invoicing documents for a contact, so the name of a relevant
>   invoicing must be used instead (Financial Department or parent
>   Company).
>
>   6) In "Analysis" reporting views, result that are grouped by partner
>   will not be automatically aggregated at company level.
>
>   == Proposed Solution==
>
>   The rationale for the proposed solution is based on the following points:
>   - We think the 7.0 partner model is appropriate and should not be
> considered the cause for these functional/usability problems
>   - We think the solution should be mostly handled by the res.partner
> model itself, so that it fixes most modules automatically.
>   - We think that in many cases, using a contact/address is the right
> level of granularity, and any reporting based on that is fundamentally
> correct. Invoicing/Accounting is specific for the reasons mentioned above,
> and automatically selecting the proper entity to use should make reporting
> provide the expected result.
>
>   Based on this, we propose the following solution. Parts A & B are
>   meant to solve the issue of using the right invoicing/accounting data
>   at all times (issues 2 & 3 mainly), while parts C, D & E  are meant to
>   improve the selection of invoicing entities and the related reporting
>   (issues 1, 4, 5 & 6):
>
>   A) Let the "commercial party" for a partner be the person or company
>   that is used as reference for all invoicing/accounting matters. The
>   "commercial party" is computed as: the first parent that is marked as
>   a company (is_company is checked) or is the root of the hierarchy if
>   there is no company. It can be the partner itself if it's a company or
>   if it has no parent.
>
>   B) The relevant invoicing/accounting data will only be editable on an
> "commercial party", and all contacts/addresses that are descendants of an
> "commercial party" will inherit those settings. This will be done as
> follows:
>   - when a partner is not an commercial party, the form view will be
> modified: the Accounting tab and the Invoicing section of the
> Sales&Purchases tab will be replaced by a note that says something like
> "Invoicing settings are controlled on <link to commercial party>".
>   - when writing() on a partner that is an commercial party, all the
> values of invoicing/accounting-related fields will be automatically copied
> to all descendants that are not commercial party themselves (e.g.
> pricelist, G/L accounts, payment terms, etc.). The list of fields to copy
> will be returned by a method on res.partner that can be overridden in other
> modules.
>   - when changing the parent of a partner causes a change of "commercial
> party", the same fields will be copied
>
>   C) When a contact/address is selected as the reference for a business
> document (SO/PO), the system should automatically select appropriate
> invoicing and delivery parties from the relevant "commercial party".  This
> is the responsibility of the res.partner.address_get() method (legacy name
> for backwards-compatibility), and it must be adapted for the new model.
>   The new algorithm should search in the whole hierarchy of the partner,
> stopping at the parent "commercial party", as defined in A. This will be
> used automatically by the on_change triggers on SO/PO/etc, and should
> ensure that the proper invoicing and delivery partners are always selected.
>
>   D) The res.partner.address_get() method considers the partner type
> "default" as a wildcard, so any partner with type "default" is seen as a
> match for any requested type. This is correct but unfortunately "default"
> is the default value, which would stop the lookup described in C at the
> first step. The "default type" for a partner will be changed to "contact",
> so that unless otherwise specified a simple contact cannot be used as
> "invoicing partner" or "delivery partner", unless it is itself a
> "commercial party".
>   Note: even if a simple contact has type "default" or "invoicing", the
> accounting/invoicing settings would still come from the relevant
> "commercial party". It will simply be seen as a possible choice for the
> "invoice partner"  (e.g. the partner_invoice_id field on a SO)
>
>   E) The search view of the main business documents will use the
>   "child_of" operator when matching contacts/partners. For example all
>   invoices issued to any contact from Agrolait will be found when
>   searching for "Partner: Agrolait".
>
>   UPDATE:
>   F) (Already implemented in 7.0) When booking journal entries for any
> partner, the system always links them to the "commercial party" related to
> the partner (the first parent company or root partner). This makes sure
> that reporting and reconciling Journal entries will always work properly.
>
>
>   == How does the solution solve the issues ==
>
>   Let's address the issues one by one:
>
>   1) When selecting a contact as the Customer for a Sales Order, a
>   proper "invoice address" and "delivery address" will now be
>   automatically selected, thanks to C & D.
>
>   2) Any code in business modules that deals with invoicing/accounting
>   related data should automatically use the data of the "commercial
>   party", thanks to B, because the data should always be in sync.
>
>   3) Directly addressed by B.
>
>   4) Directly addressed by E.
>
>   5) Thanks to C & D, an appropriate "invoicing partner" should always
>   be automatically set on SO/PO, in B2C and in B2B cases. So if you want
>   "Agrolait" to be displayed on all invoices that corresponds to SOs
>   issued for "Sylvie Lelitre (Agrolait)", just make sure that "Sylvie
>   Lelite" does not have "invoice" or "default" type, but has type
>   "contact" instead (which will be the default).
>
>   6) Due to the previous points (especially 5), an appropriate invoicing
>   partner should always be selected on all invoices, regardless of who
>   what the contact to which the SO/PO was issued. This will make
>   reporting behave as expected in most cases. There will be cases where
>   the contact granularity appears (e.g when grouping Sales Orders on
>   Customer), but this expected and correct. In general the same contact
>   will appear for most documents related to the same commercial party.
>
>   For all other case, such as domains, contexts, etc., contacts should
>   be a valid level of granularity, keeping in mind the major use cases:
>   B2B with 2 levels of hierarchy: company and contacts, and B2C with 1
>   level (normal case) or 2 levels of hierarchy (ecommerce/webshops with
>   multiple addresses for each customer)
>
>   == Further refinements ==
>
>   In trunk some extra things could be planned to further improve some
> aspects, such as:
>   - the "commercial party" field could become a stored function field on
> res.partner, so that it becomes very easy to add related fields on any
> document - making reporting per company even easier.
>   - other suggestions welcome
>
> To manage notifications about this bug go to:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/openobject-addons/+bug/1160365/+subscriptions
>



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