Juju needs a -v switch

[Nick Veitch]

running juju -v <anything> returns the following:

  $ juju -v <xxx>
  verbose is deprecated with the current meaning, use show-log

There are a number of issues with this:

* -v is a standard unix option. Removing it does not really make any useful contribution to making juju easier to use/understand

* -v is already mentioned extensively in the docs. Its removal was not mentioned in any release notes. Removing user facing functionality without mentioning it in the docs or the release notes is a very BAD THING.

* adding an additional command doesn't diminish the utility of -v, so it is unclear why it was removed.

[Nick Veitch (evilnick)]

addendum - I notice this change was mentioned in the 15.1 release notes, but without any clear explanation of why --verbose was dropped

[John A Meinel (jameinel)]

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On 2013-10-09 22:38, Nick Veitch wrote:
> addendum - I notice this change was mentioned in the 15.1 release
> notes, but without any clear explanation of why --verbose was
> dropped
>

The intent was to re-introduce it with a different meaning (rather
than just show the log dump with timestamps, etc, actually give
user-level descriptions about what is going on.)

John
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[Nick Veitch (evilnick)]

yes, reintroducing it with more user-useful output would be great. But it would also be great if it still worked in the meantime.
I don't see what is being gained by simply turning it off.

[Ian Booth (wallyworld)]

It's not turned off though, is it? It still works as before, however there is a deprecation message. The reason for the deprecation message is that the semantics of -v are changing and users who are used to using -v to see the logging output might be surprised if the output were suddenly changed without any warning.

[Nick Veitch (evilnick)]

ah, yes it does. apparently I tried it with a command that emitted nothing to the log. I still thing we should leave this as a bug until there is a 'proper' -v