Text on path mirrored / backwards (inside flipped group or layer)

[reetp]

Inkscape 0.48.2 r9819 on LinuxMint kernel 3.0.0-16-generic

This seems related to some other bugs but I'm not sure if it is identical so reporting it anyway.

Bug #169126 “Text boxes appear upside-down after PDF import”
Bug #259329 “Text in flowed text is upside down”
Bug #727876 “Text Flowing into Frame is upside down and mirrored”

https://answers.launchpad.net/inkscape/+question/78054/

This describes things very well :

http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=3042&f=5

Open a previously saved file.

Type some text (not in frame). Create a path - e.g. circle etc.

Put Text on Path

The text will be added but it is 'mirrored' or 'backwards'

It seems that this occurs (from the looks of other bugs) that it occurs when files have been saved/opened as PDF at some point.

[su_v (suv-lp)]

> Open a previously saved file.
> Type some text (not in frame). Create a path - e.g. circle etc.
> Put Text on Path
> The text will be added but it is 'mirrored' or 'backwards'

Please attach a sample SVG file: this does not occur with most files created completely in Inkscape (i.e. without a layer transform attribute which flips the content of the layer, as happens with PDF/PS/EPS files opened in Inkscape).

[su_v (suv-lp)]

Attaching a sample file with an "artificially" vertically flipped layer demonstrating the issue.
(Note: Inkscape does not have a GUI to apply such a transformation to a newly created layer)

[su_v (suv-lp)]

Attaching a sample file with a vertically flipped group demonstrating the same issue (each group is on a separate layer, which themselves do not have nor need a transformation).
(Note: you need to enter the vertically flipped group and add shapes + text within the group to reproduce it).

[reetp (jcrisp)]

Created Inkscape svg file with text on path (Hello).
Saved it as SVG.
Saved it as PDF.
Opened PDF and added a new path and text (Hello2)

Error occurs

[reetp (jcrisp)]

Now open original SVG file
Error still occurs.

[reetp (jcrisp)]

Sorry - ignore last - can't read the right way up !

[reetp (jcrisp)]

Same occurrence with EPS files.
Create and save SVG file.
Save as EPS.
Open EPS
Error Occurs

[su_v (suv-lp)]

Same issue described in comment #5 of
Bug #571373 “Latex formula rendered upside down”
<https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/571373>
(The mentioned extension to measure the length of a path inserts the label as 'text put on path')

[reetp (jcrisp)]

I saw that and did wonder if it was related.

[su_v (suv-lp)]

Related issue with text flowed into frame: see comment #11 in
Bug #727876 “Text Flowing into Frame is upside down and mirrored”
<https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/727876>

Not sure if it would be desirable or possible to implement a similar hack to ignore (or compensate) certain layer transforms for text put in path and flowed into frame (as it currently does for text entered interactively inside such layers (or groups)).

<off-topic comment on workflow>
> It seems that this occurs (from the looks of other bugs) that it
> occurs when files have been saved/opened as PDF at some point.

When editing EPS/PS/PDF files in Inkscape to add e.g. a vector-based overlay, it might be best to create a new layer, and work on that new layer to avoid unexpected results e.g. with special text objects as reported here (and in bug #571373 and bug #727876). A newly created empty layer does not have a transform attribute (specially not one that flips and scales the layer group as a whole).

> Created Inkscape svg file with text on path (Hello).
> Saved it as SVG.
> Saved it as PDF.
> Opened PDF and added a new path and text (Hello2)

Note: repeated round-trip editing of PDF/PS/EPS files in Inkscape (an SVG Editor) cannot guarantee to keep appearance exactly the same (due to the different set of features supported by each of the vector file formats) and often results in slightly different document structures due to the conversion (EPS ->) PDF -> SVG -> PDF occurring each time the file is opened (converted to SVG) and saved as (converted from SVG to other vector format). If multiple edits of such files are required, save first as Inkscape SVG, then edit the SVG file and only save a copy as PDF/PS/EPS again after all edits have been done.
</off-topic>

[reetp (jcrisp)]

Thanks for the comments - I understand now, though I am not sure how I will work it. I rarely ever need or use layers. Just added complication.

My normal working practice means that I usually save in SVG, save in PDF (as that is what the clients want to see), continue working on the file for any modifications, save in SVG and then again in PDF - e.g. I had considered the PDF save as an 'Export' and that although the file was WRITTEN as PDF, I had no idea it affected the actual structure of the file that I was working with (as in 'held in memory' rather than the object written to disk)

Yes, I can accept that if I opened a PDF version of the file that it may have some changes or not be compatible, but NOT that the original file that I was working on would have altered that significantly, nor that once said PDF was opened, I would be working with a PDF file structure and not SVG.

Hence it has taken me a while to figure out what was going on.

This should certainly be made clearer somehow. Why does the format of the file being worked on have to change if the file is being saved ? Whilst the file is effectively being held in RAM, does it matter what format is written to disk ?

Perhaps the answer is thinking differently about the terms import/open and save/export ? Or a warning when opening or saving to say a PDF that you will be working in it's native format and odd things may occur.

Not really sure what the answer is, but the system 'doesn't work as expected' so something needs changing !

[su_v (suv-lp)]

<off-topic>
> Perhaps the answer is thinking differently about the terms import/open and save/export ?

Known issue, a complete reorg of the save and export functions is on the roadmap (no ETA). See also the blueprint
<https://blueprints.launchpad.net/inkscape/+spec/save-as-vs-export>
and the linked page for details about the proposal in the Inkscape wiki.

Export in Inkscape to other vector formats corresponds to 'Save a copy as…' (the saved file is not loaded in the current document window), whereas 'Save as…' replaces the current document with the saved version.
</off-topic>

[reetp (jcrisp)]

Ok.

Worst problem is when a file is saved as SVG, then PDF, closed and you (or a.n.other) come back to work on the SVG 3 months later.....

So in my case the answer is to Save a Copy. IMHO it would be better to retain the current window in Inkscape format, whatever the save format may be unless clearly notified otherwise. I may not be alone in thinking that there was not another way !

Thanks for your help and keep up the execellent work