| 2015-03-08 20:11:56 |
sysaxed |
description |
Currently there is no way to save a simple svg without additional stuff in it. It looks like there are many optimizers on the internet, but it would be great if inkscape at least allowed not to include invisible stuff. "Plain .svg" and "Optimized .svg" sound like they should do something like this, but they don't.
Here is an IRC discussion:
04:36:31<Sysaxed> How can I save an svg without any crap that is not
associated with the final result? For example, I have an
image on the hidden layer. Why is it exported? I've tried
plain svg and compressed svg, no luck
04:37:24<FailBit> don't embed the image
04:37:27<FailBit> plain&simple
04:37:37<Sysaxed> why? It is needed for drawing purposes
04:37:47<FailBit> but you said you don't want it exported
04:37:50<Sysaxed> why would it export hidden layers? I don't understand
04:37:59<FailBit> because they are still important
04:38:07<Sysaxed> like... for what?
04:38:18<FailBit> you can reference [xlink:href] items on any layers with any
visibility settings
04:38:23<FailBit> as well as include <defs> anywhere
04:38:47<FailBit> so instead of special casing all that jazz, we export hidden
layers too
04:38:57<Sysaxed> so do I get it right that I have to delete ALL invisible
layers?
04:39:05<FailBit> yes
04:39:22<Sysaxed> and there is no simple checkbox "don't include hidden
layers" anywhere?...
04:39:26<FailBit> no
04:39:35<Sysaxed> and are you saying that it shouldn't even be there?
04:39:44*** ted_ (~ted@cpe-76-187-224-40.tx.res.rr.com) has joined channel
#inkscape
04:40:01<FailBit> nope
04:43:07<Sysaxed> "The command File → icon Vacuum Defs removes unused
definitions from the <defs> section of the SVG file. This
includes things like unused gradients, patterns, markers,
and filters."
04:43:17<Sysaxed> so what does this mean then?
04:43:58<FailBit> unreferenced items in <defs>
04:44:20<Sysaxed> yea, right
04:44:29<Sysaxed> hm
04:44:39<FailBit> items with a hrefcount of 0
04:44:40<FailBit> as in
04:44:45<FailBit> nothing points an xlink:href to them
04:44:52<FailBit> so they don't mean anything
04:44:55<FailBit> and can be wiped out
04:47:51<Sysaxed> well, I still don't get it. As I work on the image I have
lots of hidden layers here and there. Sometimes I want to
export a fully adequate vector image (just image, nothing
else). So each time I have to go through my layers, delete
them all, then export?... I don't know
04:48:13<Sysaxed> perhaps I'm retarded, but it sounds like the thing I need is
pretty common
04:48:19<FailBit> I don't think it is
04:48:25<FailBit> generally when you save an image
04:48:34<FailBit> you want the parts of it that you were editing to still be
there
04:49:21<Sysaxed> FailBit: and what do you mean by that?
04:49:34<FailBit> you are working on a piece
04:49:37<FailBit> you hide a layer
04:49:38<FailBit> you save
04:49:40<FailBit> re-open
04:49:41<FailBit> oops
04:49:43<FailBit> what the hell
04:49:44<FailBit> it's gone
04:49:45<Sysaxed> Wrong.
04:49:46<FailBit> whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
04:50:03<Sysaxed> There are Inkscape .svg and Plain .svg options
04:50:11<Sysaxed> and Compressed .svg
04:50:17<FailBit> compressed svg is inkscape svg
04:50:21<FailBit> but gzipped
04:50:31<Sysaxed> Wrong again?
04:50:41<Sysaxed> ah no
04:50:45<FailBit> ok, I'm wrong
04:50:48<Sysaxed> sorry, I wanted to say "Optimized .svg"
04:50:50<FailBit> please ignore everything I've said
04:50:58<FailBit> and continue on with your life
04:51:26<Sysaxed> so yeah, three options: "Inkscape .svg", "Plain .svg" and
"Optimized .svg"
04:51:56<Sysaxed> obviously, inkscape .svg contains all of the layers data and
so on
04:52:02<Sysaxed> plain .svg doesn't
04:52:08<FailBit> why not?
04:52:16<Sysaxed> FailBit: because it doesn't
04:52:38<Sysaxed> I mean, if you import it back you wont see any layers
04:53:08<FailBit> they still exist
04:53:15<FailBit> they just don't have inkscape:groupmode="layer"
04:53:20<Sysaxed> yup
04:55:09<Sysaxed> I wonder how many svgs on the internet have invisible shit
in them. Maybe I would have never noticed it if one of my
hidden layers did not contain a raster image
04:56:42<FailBit> and why is this concerning
04:57:12<FailBit> the people that are actually concerned about optimizing
their images have already done so
04:58:20<Sysaxed> FailBit: any svg optimizer you can suggest?
04:58:28<FailBit> your brain
04:58:58<Sysaxed> you mean by editing .svgs as text files?
04:59:04<FailBit> yes
04:59:11<Sysaxed> ummmmm...
04:59:18<FailBit> I do it all the time
04:59:35<FailBit> <svg><path id="R" d="M9-12C0-7 4,14-9,12 0,7-4-14 9-12Z"
fill="#63b7ff"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(30)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(60)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(90)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(120)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(150)"/><circle fill="#deefff"
stroke="#a5d4ff" r="6.8"/></svg>
05:00:15<Tenacious-Techhu> Isn't the whole point of a software tool like
Inkscape is that it takes care of all the pointless
petty details FOR you?
05:00:39<Tenacious-Techhu> If editing the XML was the correct solution,
Inkscape shouldn't exist to begin with.
05:01:08<FailBit> Tenacious-Techhu: this is about a specific workflow that is
NOT related to maintaining editable work files
05:01:22*** pandeiro (~user@187.38.75.221) has quit: Ping timeout: 240 seconds
05:01:35<Tenacious-Techhu> So?
05:01:51<FailBit> so inkscape's lakk of support for it is not surprising in
the slightest
05:02:01<Tenacious-Techhu> Just because he wants a finished end product, that
doesn't mean it isn't Inkscape's job to deliver that.
05:02:25* FailBit reverts to ponies
05:02:55<Tenacious-Techhu> Inkscape's relevance is directly proportional to
its suitability to the set of all tasks to which it
can be put to.
05:03:26<FailBit> I don't care about its relevance
05:03:37<FailBit> I care about it being able to do the job it was designed to
do
05:03:46<FailBit> provide a decent way to edit vector images
05:03:56<FailBit> not optimize the shit out of a finished image
05:04:19<FailBit> scour.py is useful if that's what you want.
05:04:40<Sysaxed> Tenacious-Techhu: thanks
05:06:16<Tenacious-Techhu> Sysaxed, I'm with you on this one. FailBit seems to
think only his use-cases matter. :P
05:08:54<FailBit> Tenacious-Techhu, Sysaxed: read up on the unix philosophy
05:09:04<Sysaxed> Tenacious-Techhu: maybe I should open a feature request?
05:09:11<Tenacious-Techhu> To hell with the Unix philosophy. :P
05:09:15<Tenacious-Techhu> Do it.
05:09:27<Tenacious-Techhu> The Unix philosophy never got anyone anywhere.
05:09:36*** FailBit (~liamw@unaffiliated/liamw) has kicked Tenacious-Techhu
off channel #inkscape: trolling
05:09:48<Sysaxed> well, what the fuck?
05:09:56<FailBit> I didn't ban him
05:10:08<FailBit> I'm just really pissed off
05:10:34<Sysaxed> FailBit: just take a break... |
Currently there is no way to save a simple svg without additional stuff in it. It looks like there are many optimizers on the internet, but it would be great if inkscape at least allowed not to include invisible stuff. "Plain .svg" and "Optimized .svg" sound like they should do something like this, but they don't.
Here is an IRC discussion:
04:36:31<Sysaxed> How can I save an svg without any crap that is not
associated with the final result? For example, I have an
image on the hidden layer. Why is it exported? I've tried
plain svg and compressed svg, no luck
04:37:24<FailBit> don't embed the image
04:37:27<FailBit> plain&simple
04:37:37<Sysaxed> why? It is needed for drawing purposes
04:37:47<FailBit> but you said you don't want it exported
04:37:50<Sysaxed> why would it export hidden layers? I don't understand
04:37:59<FailBit> because they are still important
04:38:07<Sysaxed> like... for what?
04:38:18<FailBit> you can reference [xlink:href] items on any layers with any
visibility settings
04:38:23<FailBit> as well as include <defs> anywhere
04:38:47<FailBit> so instead of special casing all that jazz, we export hidden
layers too
04:38:57<Sysaxed> so do I get it right that I have to delete ALL invisible
layers?
04:39:05<FailBit> yes
04:39:22<Sysaxed> and there is no simple checkbox "don't include hidden
layers" anywhere?...
04:39:26<FailBit> no
04:39:35<Sysaxed> and are you saying that it shouldn't even be there?
04:40:01<FailBit> nope
04:43:07<Sysaxed> "The command File → icon Vacuum Defs removes unused
definitions from the <defs> section of the SVG file. This
includes things like unused gradients, patterns, markers,
and filters."
04:43:17<Sysaxed> so what does this mean then?
04:43:58<FailBit> unreferenced items in <defs>
04:44:20<Sysaxed> yea, right
04:44:29<Sysaxed> hm
04:44:39<FailBit> items with a hrefcount of 0
04:44:40<FailBit> as in
04:44:45<FailBit> nothing points an xlink:href to them
04:44:52<FailBit> so they don't mean anything
04:44:55<FailBit> and can be wiped out
04:47:51<Sysaxed> well, I still don't get it. As I work on the image I have
lots of hidden layers here and there. Sometimes I want to
export a fully adequate vector image (just image, nothing
else). So each time I have to go through my layers, delete
them all, then export?... I don't know
04:48:13<Sysaxed> perhaps I'm retarded, but it sounds like the thing I need is
pretty common
04:48:19<FailBit> I don't think it is
04:48:25<FailBit> generally when you save an image
04:48:34<FailBit> you want the parts of it that you were editing to still be
there
04:49:21<Sysaxed> FailBit: and what do you mean by that?
04:49:34<FailBit> you are working on a piece
04:49:37<FailBit> you hide a layer
04:49:38<FailBit> you save
04:49:40<FailBit> re-open
04:49:41<FailBit> oops
04:49:43<FailBit> what the hell
04:49:44<FailBit> it's gone
04:49:45<Sysaxed> Wrong.
04:49:46<FailBit> whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
04:50:03<Sysaxed> There are Inkscape .svg and Plain .svg options
04:50:11<Sysaxed> and Compressed .svg
04:50:17<FailBit> compressed svg is inkscape svg
04:50:21<FailBit> but gzipped
04:50:31<Sysaxed> Wrong again?
04:50:41<Sysaxed> ah no
04:50:45<FailBit> ok, I'm wrong
04:50:48<Sysaxed> sorry, I wanted to say "Optimized .svg"
04:50:50<FailBit> please ignore everything I've said
04:50:58<FailBit> and continue on with your life
04:51:26<Sysaxed> so yeah, three options: "Inkscape .svg", "Plain .svg" and
"Optimized .svg"
04:51:56<Sysaxed> obviously, inkscape .svg contains all of the layers data and
so on
04:52:02<Sysaxed> plain .svg doesn't
04:52:08<FailBit> why not?
04:52:16<Sysaxed> FailBit: because it doesn't
04:52:38<Sysaxed> I mean, if you import it back you wont see any layers
04:53:08<FailBit> they still exist
04:53:15<FailBit> they just don't have inkscape:groupmode="layer"
04:53:20<Sysaxed> yup
04:55:09<Sysaxed> I wonder how many svgs on the internet have invisible shit
in them. Maybe I would have never noticed it if one of my
hidden layers did not contain a raster image
04:56:42<FailBit> and why is this concerning
04:57:12<FailBit> the people that are actually concerned about optimizing
their images have already done so
04:58:20<Sysaxed> FailBit: any svg optimizer you can suggest?
04:58:28<FailBit> your brain
04:58:58<Sysaxed> you mean by editing .svgs as text files?
04:59:04<FailBit> yes
04:59:11<Sysaxed> ummmmm...
04:59:18<FailBit> I do it all the time
04:59:35<FailBit> <svg><path id="R" d="M9-12C0-7 4,14-9,12 0,7-4-14 9-12Z"
fill="#63b7ff"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(30)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(60)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(90)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(120)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(150)"/><circle fill="#deefff"
stroke="#a5d4ff" r="6.8"/></svg>
05:00:15<Tenacious-Techhu> Isn't the whole point of a software tool like
Inkscape is that it takes care of all the pointless
petty details FOR you?
05:00:39<Tenacious-Techhu> If editing the XML was the correct solution,
Inkscape shouldn't exist to begin with.
05:01:08<FailBit> Tenacious-Techhu: this is about a specific workflow that is
NOT related to maintaining editable work files
05:01:35<Tenacious-Techhu> So?
05:01:51<FailBit> so inkscape's lakk of support for it is not surprising in
the slightest
05:02:01<Tenacious-Techhu> Just because he wants a finished end product, that
doesn't mean it isn't Inkscape's job to deliver that.
05:02:25* FailBit reverts to ponies
05:02:55<Tenacious-Techhu> Inkscape's relevance is directly proportional to
its suitability to the set of all tasks to which it
can be put to.
05:03:26<FailBit> I don't care about its relevance
05:03:37<FailBit> I care about it being able to do the job it was designed to
do
05:03:46<FailBit> provide a decent way to edit vector images
05:03:56<FailBit> not optimize the shit out of a finished image
05:04:19<FailBit> scour.py is useful if that's what you want.
05:04:40<Sysaxed> Tenacious-Techhu: thanks
05:06:16<Tenacious-Techhu> Sysaxed, I'm with you on this one. FailBit seems to
think only his use-cases matter. :P
05:08:54<FailBit> Tenacious-Techhu, Sysaxed: read up on the unix philosophy
05:09:04<Sysaxed> Tenacious-Techhu: maybe I should open a feature request?
05:09:11<Tenacious-Techhu> To hell with the Unix philosophy. :P
05:09:15<Tenacious-Techhu> Do it.
05:09:27<Tenacious-Techhu> The Unix philosophy never got anyone anywhere.
05:09:36*** FailBit (~liamw@unaffiliated/liamw) has kicked Tenacious-Techhu
off channel #inkscape: trolling
05:09:48<Sysaxed> well, what the fuck?
05:09:56<FailBit> I didn't ban him
05:10:08<FailBit> I'm just really pissed off
05:10:34<Sysaxed> FailBit: just take a break... |
|
| 2015-03-08 21:12:40 |
su_v |
description |
Currently there is no way to save a simple svg without additional stuff in it. It looks like there are many optimizers on the internet, but it would be great if inkscape at least allowed not to include invisible stuff. "Plain .svg" and "Optimized .svg" sound like they should do something like this, but they don't.
Here is an IRC discussion:
04:36:31<Sysaxed> How can I save an svg without any crap that is not
associated with the final result? For example, I have an
image on the hidden layer. Why is it exported? I've tried
plain svg and compressed svg, no luck
04:37:24<FailBit> don't embed the image
04:37:27<FailBit> plain&simple
04:37:37<Sysaxed> why? It is needed for drawing purposes
04:37:47<FailBit> but you said you don't want it exported
04:37:50<Sysaxed> why would it export hidden layers? I don't understand
04:37:59<FailBit> because they are still important
04:38:07<Sysaxed> like... for what?
04:38:18<FailBit> you can reference [xlink:href] items on any layers with any
visibility settings
04:38:23<FailBit> as well as include <defs> anywhere
04:38:47<FailBit> so instead of special casing all that jazz, we export hidden
layers too
04:38:57<Sysaxed> so do I get it right that I have to delete ALL invisible
layers?
04:39:05<FailBit> yes
04:39:22<Sysaxed> and there is no simple checkbox "don't include hidden
layers" anywhere?...
04:39:26<FailBit> no
04:39:35<Sysaxed> and are you saying that it shouldn't even be there?
04:40:01<FailBit> nope
04:43:07<Sysaxed> "The command File → icon Vacuum Defs removes unused
definitions from the <defs> section of the SVG file. This
includes things like unused gradients, patterns, markers,
and filters."
04:43:17<Sysaxed> so what does this mean then?
04:43:58<FailBit> unreferenced items in <defs>
04:44:20<Sysaxed> yea, right
04:44:29<Sysaxed> hm
04:44:39<FailBit> items with a hrefcount of 0
04:44:40<FailBit> as in
04:44:45<FailBit> nothing points an xlink:href to them
04:44:52<FailBit> so they don't mean anything
04:44:55<FailBit> and can be wiped out
04:47:51<Sysaxed> well, I still don't get it. As I work on the image I have
lots of hidden layers here and there. Sometimes I want to
export a fully adequate vector image (just image, nothing
else). So each time I have to go through my layers, delete
them all, then export?... I don't know
04:48:13<Sysaxed> perhaps I'm retarded, but it sounds like the thing I need is
pretty common
04:48:19<FailBit> I don't think it is
04:48:25<FailBit> generally when you save an image
04:48:34<FailBit> you want the parts of it that you were editing to still be
there
04:49:21<Sysaxed> FailBit: and what do you mean by that?
04:49:34<FailBit> you are working on a piece
04:49:37<FailBit> you hide a layer
04:49:38<FailBit> you save
04:49:40<FailBit> re-open
04:49:41<FailBit> oops
04:49:43<FailBit> what the hell
04:49:44<FailBit> it's gone
04:49:45<Sysaxed> Wrong.
04:49:46<FailBit> whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
04:50:03<Sysaxed> There are Inkscape .svg and Plain .svg options
04:50:11<Sysaxed> and Compressed .svg
04:50:17<FailBit> compressed svg is inkscape svg
04:50:21<FailBit> but gzipped
04:50:31<Sysaxed> Wrong again?
04:50:41<Sysaxed> ah no
04:50:45<FailBit> ok, I'm wrong
04:50:48<Sysaxed> sorry, I wanted to say "Optimized .svg"
04:50:50<FailBit> please ignore everything I've said
04:50:58<FailBit> and continue on with your life
04:51:26<Sysaxed> so yeah, three options: "Inkscape .svg", "Plain .svg" and
"Optimized .svg"
04:51:56<Sysaxed> obviously, inkscape .svg contains all of the layers data and
so on
04:52:02<Sysaxed> plain .svg doesn't
04:52:08<FailBit> why not?
04:52:16<Sysaxed> FailBit: because it doesn't
04:52:38<Sysaxed> I mean, if you import it back you wont see any layers
04:53:08<FailBit> they still exist
04:53:15<FailBit> they just don't have inkscape:groupmode="layer"
04:53:20<Sysaxed> yup
04:55:09<Sysaxed> I wonder how many svgs on the internet have invisible shit
in them. Maybe I would have never noticed it if one of my
hidden layers did not contain a raster image
04:56:42<FailBit> and why is this concerning
04:57:12<FailBit> the people that are actually concerned about optimizing
their images have already done so
04:58:20<Sysaxed> FailBit: any svg optimizer you can suggest?
04:58:28<FailBit> your brain
04:58:58<Sysaxed> you mean by editing .svgs as text files?
04:59:04<FailBit> yes
04:59:11<Sysaxed> ummmmm...
04:59:18<FailBit> I do it all the time
04:59:35<FailBit> <svg><path id="R" d="M9-12C0-7 4,14-9,12 0,7-4-14 9-12Z"
fill="#63b7ff"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(30)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(60)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(90)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(120)"/><use xlink:href="#R"
transform="rotate(150)"/><circle fill="#deefff"
stroke="#a5d4ff" r="6.8"/></svg>
05:00:15<Tenacious-Techhu> Isn't the whole point of a software tool like
Inkscape is that it takes care of all the pointless
petty details FOR you?
05:00:39<Tenacious-Techhu> If editing the XML was the correct solution,
Inkscape shouldn't exist to begin with.
05:01:08<FailBit> Tenacious-Techhu: this is about a specific workflow that is
NOT related to maintaining editable work files
05:01:35<Tenacious-Techhu> So?
05:01:51<FailBit> so inkscape's lakk of support for it is not surprising in
the slightest
05:02:01<Tenacious-Techhu> Just because he wants a finished end product, that
doesn't mean it isn't Inkscape's job to deliver that.
05:02:25* FailBit reverts to ponies
05:02:55<Tenacious-Techhu> Inkscape's relevance is directly proportional to
its suitability to the set of all tasks to which it
can be put to.
05:03:26<FailBit> I don't care about its relevance
05:03:37<FailBit> I care about it being able to do the job it was designed to
do
05:03:46<FailBit> provide a decent way to edit vector images
05:03:56<FailBit> not optimize the shit out of a finished image
05:04:19<FailBit> scour.py is useful if that's what you want.
05:04:40<Sysaxed> Tenacious-Techhu: thanks
05:06:16<Tenacious-Techhu> Sysaxed, I'm with you on this one. FailBit seems to
think only his use-cases matter. :P
05:08:54<FailBit> Tenacious-Techhu, Sysaxed: read up on the unix philosophy
05:09:04<Sysaxed> Tenacious-Techhu: maybe I should open a feature request?
05:09:11<Tenacious-Techhu> To hell with the Unix philosophy. :P
05:09:15<Tenacious-Techhu> Do it.
05:09:27<Tenacious-Techhu> The Unix philosophy never got anyone anywhere.
05:09:36*** FailBit (~liamw@unaffiliated/liamw) has kicked Tenacious-Techhu
off channel #inkscape: trolling
05:09:48<Sysaxed> well, what the fuck?
05:09:56<FailBit> I didn't ban him
05:10:08<FailBit> I'm just really pissed off
05:10:34<Sysaxed> FailBit: just take a break... |
Currently there is no way to save a simple svg without additional stuff in it. It looks like there are many optimizers on the internet, but it would be great if inkscape at least allowed not to include invisible stuff. "Plain .svg" and "Optimized .svg" sound like they should do something like this, but they don't. |
|
