Crash every minute, ... is there a log file i can post to improve Open-Shot?

Bug #807028 reported by Bernd Faulstich
24
This bug affects 5 people
Affects Status Importance Assigned to Milestone
OpenShot Video Editor
New
Undecided
Unassigned

Bug Description

Using Ubuntu Ubuntu 10.04 LTS - Lucid Lynx kernel 2.6.32-32-generic with GNOME 2.30.2
Using Synaptic or DEB-packages to install.
OpenShot 1.3.1 installed today (7.7.2011)
Now i see point 4) [attach openshot.debug] - i will if i find the path...

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

I did not find a file named openshot.debug at my system. Is there a setting i have to activate?

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :
Download full text (18.6 KiB)

Found
https://answers.launchpad.net/openshot/+faq/1032
and downloaded
http://launchpad.net/openshot/build-wizard/1.0.7/+download/debug.py
and finally i found what i searched for...
The openshot.debug :-) (rtfm...or...rtfFAQ;-)
So is there something wrong?

-----------------------------------------------------------
OpenShot Debug File 0.0.2 - 2011-07-07 17:33:38.317650
-----------------------------------------------------------
This file contains a list of installed packages related to OpenShot,
locations of files, and a list of shared libraries used by python-mlt.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Distribution Version Info
-----------------------------------------------------------
LSB Version: core-2.0-amd64:core-2.0-noarch:core-3.0-amd64:core-3.0-noarch:core-3.1-amd64:core-3.1-noarch:core-3.2-amd64:core-3.2-noarch:core-4.0-amd64:core-4.0-noarch
Distributor ID: Ubuntu
Description: Ubuntu 10.04.2 LTS
Release: 10.04
Codename: lucid

-----------------------------------------------------------
List of Installed Packages
-----------------------------------------------------------
Gewünscht=Unbekannt/Installieren/R=Entfernen/P=Vollständig Löschen/Halten
| Status=Nicht/Installiert/Config/U=Entpackt/Fehlgeschl. Konfiguration/
         Halb installiert/Trigger erWartet/Trigger anhängig
|/ Fehler?=(kein)/R=Neuinstallation notwendig (Status, Fehler: GROSS=schlecht)
||/ Name Version Beschreibung
+++-=====================================-===============================================-============================================
un libmlt1 <keine> (keine Beschreibung vorhanden)
ii libmlt2 0.5.4-1 multimedia framework (runtime)
ii openshot 1.3.1-1 Create and edit videos and movies
ii python-mlt2 0.5.4-1 multimedia framework (python bindings)
Kein Paket gefunden, das auf python-mlt passt.
Kein Paket gefunden, das auf openshot-mlt passt.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Python Path (i.e. sys.path)
-----------------------------------------------------------
/home/bernibaerchen/Downloads
/usr/lib/python2.6
/usr/lib/python2.6/plat-linux2
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-tk
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-old
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-dynload
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/PIL
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gst-0.10
/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gtk-2.0
/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/gtk-2.0
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/wx-2.8-gtk2-unicode
/usr/local/lib/python2.6/dist-packages

-----------------------------------------------------------
Files in /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/mlt (used by python-mlt)
-----------------------------------------------------------
find: "/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/mlt": Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefunden

-----------------------------------------------------------
Attempt to...

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

I searched for "python-mlt" with Synaptic and found only "python-mlt2".
For "openshot-mlt" was no result.

Revision history for this message
Olivier Girard (eolinwen) wrote :

Hi,
Take a look here : http://openshotusers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=758 and here too but I have just seen that this is just the only part of the manual in German which is not translate :=)
You must have all this dependencies installed.
Thanks.

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

i installed al ubuntu dependencies, but it did not work.
i aktivated auto-save so after every crash i got all done changes. :-)
but the startup after every crash...

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :
Download full text (18.2 KiB)

Now my Openshot.debug looks like
^[[Abernibaerchen@bernibaerchen-laptop:~/Downloads$ python debug.py
-----------------------------------------------------------
OpenShot Debug File 0.0.2 - 2011-07-08 08:51:14.772936
-----------------------------------------------------------
This file contains a list of installed packages related to OpenShot,
locations of files, and a list of shared libraries used by python-mlt.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Distribution Version Info
-----------------------------------------------------------
LSB Version: core-2.0-amd64:core-2.0-noarch:core-3.0-amd64:core-3.0-noarch:core-3.1-amd64:core-3.1-noarch:core-3.2-amd64:core-3.2-noarch:core-4.0-amd64:core-4.0-noarch
Distributor ID: Ubuntu
Description: Ubuntu 10.04.2 LTS
Release: 10.04
Codename: lucid

-----------------------------------------------------------
List of Installed Packages
-----------------------------------------------------------
Gewünscht=Unbekannt/Installieren/R=Entfernen/P=Vollständig Löschen/Halten
| Status=Nicht/Installiert/Config/U=Entpackt/Fehlgeschl. Konfiguration/
         Halb installiert/Trigger erWartet/Trigger anhängig
|/ Fehler?=(kein)/R=Neuinstallation notwendig (Status, Fehler: GROSS=schlecht)
||/ Name Version Beschreibung
+++-=====================================-===============================================-============================================
un libmlt1 <keine> (keine Beschreibung vorhanden)
ii libmlt2 0.5.4-1 multimedia framework (runtime)
ii openshot 1.3.1-1 Create and edit videos and movies
ii python-mlt2 0.5.4-1 multimedia framework (python bindings)
Kein Paket gefunden, das auf python-mlt passt.
Kein Paket gefunden, das auf openshot-mlt passt.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Python Path (i.e. sys.path)
-----------------------------------------------------------
/home/bernibaerchen/Downloads
/usr/lib/python2.6
/usr/lib/python2.6/plat-linux2
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-tk
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-old
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-dynload
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/PIL
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gst-0.10
/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gtk-2.0
/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/gtk-2.0
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/wx-2.8-gtk2-unicode
/usr/local/lib/python2.6/dist-packages

-----------------------------------------------------------
Files in /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/mlt (used by python-mlt)
-----------------------------------------------------------
find: "/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/mlt": Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefunden

-----------------------------------------------------------
Attempt to import mlt (using Python)
-----------------------------------------------------------
Successfully imported mlt library!

------------------------------...

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :
Revision history for this message
Andy Finch (fincha) wrote :

Can you provide some information on what you are doing when the crashes happen? Is it during playback, with or without effects, does it crash if it's idling etc.

Also, what happens if you play and seek your files with the ffplay & melt command line players? Do they have any problems?

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

remove libmlt2 with synaptic
- install libmlt4_0.7.2ubuntu0~ >> without errors :-D
and the other packages from the page.

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

openshot is not there anymore ... lol ... aaaahhhhh ... i'm a noob.
i install the 1.3.1 deb-packages from https://launchpad.net/openshot/1.3/1.3.1 again

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

crashing again... no changes.

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

Hi Andy,
1 after a crash i open my .osp-file,
2 go to my last marker and
3 play <space> to find the next point for a cut (at musik track),
4 stop there with <space>,
5 copy my last transition (fading) and
6 adjust the next clip from start
7 <TAB> to change tool
8 put it to the fading,
9 <SPACE>search next point in music
10 <SPACE>,
11 copy transition to there,
12 <TAB>
13 adjust the end of the clip,
14 click to the timeline and
15 <SPACE>
16 check the result.
goto 3

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

PS autosave is enabled, save before play is enabled and autosave is 5 min

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

Now a crash at 13 after adjusting the end of a clip

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

Now a crash at 6 after adjusting the clip from the begining

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

perhaps there is something wrong with my project-style?

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :
Download full text (19.1 KiB)

Since last install (see #7 #8 #9 & #10) my openshot.debug looks like this

bernibaerchen@bernibaerchen-laptop:~$ cd Do
Dokumente/ Downloads/
bernibaerchen@bernibaerchen-laptop:~$ cd Downloads/
bernibaerchen@bernibaerchen-laptop:~/Downloads$ python
debug.py installed/
bernibaerchen@bernibaerchen-laptop:~/Downloads$ python debug.py
-----------------------------------------------------------
OpenShot Debug File 0.0.2 - 2011-07-08 09:46:54.591362
-----------------------------------------------------------
This file contains a list of installed packages related to OpenShot,
locations of files, and a list of shared libraries used by python-mlt.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Distribution Version Info
-----------------------------------------------------------
LSB Version: core-2.0-amd64:core-2.0-noarch:core-3.0-amd64:core-3.0-noarch:core-3.1-amd64:core-3.1-noarch:core-3.2-amd64:core-3.2-noarch:core-4.0-amd64:core-4.0-noarch
Distributor ID: Ubuntu
Description: Ubuntu 10.04.2 LTS
Release: 10.04
Codename: lucid

-----------------------------------------------------------
List of Installed Packages
-----------------------------------------------------------
Gewünscht=Unbekannt/Installieren/R=Entfernen/P=Vollständig Löschen/Halten
| Status=Nicht/Installiert/Config/U=Entpackt/Fehlgeschl. Konfiguration/
         Halb installiert/Trigger erWartet/Trigger anhängig
|/ Fehler?=(kein)/R=Neuinstallation notwendig (Status, Fehler: GROSS=schlecht)
||/ Name Version Beschreibung
+++-=====================================-===============================================-============================================
un libmlt1 <keine> (keine Beschreibung vorhanden)
rc libmlt2 0.5.4-1 multimedia framework (runtime)
ii openshot 1.3.1-1 Create and edit videos and movies
un python-mlt2 <keine> (keine Beschreibung vorhanden)
Kein Paket gefunden, das auf python-mlt passt.
Kein Paket gefunden, das auf openshot-mlt passt.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Python Path (i.e. sys.path)
-----------------------------------------------------------
/home/bernibaerchen/Downloads
/usr/lib/python2.6
/usr/lib/python2.6/plat-linux2
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-tk
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-old
/usr/lib/python2.6/lib-dynload
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/PIL
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gst-0.10
/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gtk-2.0
/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/gtk-2.0
/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/wx-2.8-gtk2-unicode
/usr/local/lib/python2.6/dist-packages

-----------------------------------------------------------
Files in /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/mlt (used by python-mlt)
-----------------------------------------------------------
find: "/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/mlt": Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefund...

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

I started openshot as admin from the terminal and see the error:
[...]
[h264 @ 0x7f06d9bba570]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
[NULL @ 0x7f06d990f130]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x2c0ae20]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x2f09ae0]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x4584ed0]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x7516120]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
Speicherzugriffsfehler

could this help you?

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

I cut a video in to 2 parts and adjusted the end of the first one (like step 13). crash...
output in terminal:
[...more lines...]
[h264 @ 0x7f1b8adcd810]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x7f1b8af75210]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x7f1b710fe660]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x7f1b8af51ab0]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[NULL @ 0x7f1b8af53160]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
    Last message repeated 11 times
[NULL @ 0x7f1b710b40b0]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
[NULL @ 0x7f1b7b433a30]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x7f1b8adcc010]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x7f1b8adcf250]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x7f1b8af49110]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
Speicherzugriffsfehler

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

> Also, what happens if you play and seek your files with the ffplay & melt
> command line players? Do they have any problems?

I didn't use the commandline players until now.

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

Again after adjusting the end if the clip.
1st action move clip
2nd action adjust end
...
[...error in terminal...]
[h264 @ 0x1289c860]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x128a03f0]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
[NULL @ 0xfaca170]insufficient thread locking around avcodec_open/close()
    Last message repeated 7 times
[mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2 @ 0x128a2000]ISO: File Type Major Brand: avc1
st:0 removing common factor 1800 from timebase
st:1 removing common factor 128 from timebase
Speicherzugriffsfehler

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

OT: The cool thing is after the new packages (see #7-#10) there are no white stripes in the black areas of the clip after rendering :-)) Only the glitches before starting a clip ... but this will be fixed in 1.4 (looking forward)

So is there something i can do to give you more informations about the internal state when the crash happens?
Something how i can help you to find the root-cause for the problem?

else i think i go back to an older version this evening to speed up my editing process (not so much restarts of openshot 1.1.3-1 or 1.2.2). What version could you regiment?

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :

typo... what version coul you recommend?

Revision history for this message
Michal Kára (lemming-h) wrote :

I am having similar problems (Ubuntu 11.04, OpenShot 1.3.1, mlt3, avcoded52). When I add more than ~20 clips to the project, OpenShot crashes after a few operations. For example, resizing/cutting a clip and clicking on the timeline (so that preview of clip in that time would be generated) crashes it almost every time. There are no effect, just a simple clip. ffplay / melt work without problems. Although OpenShot is far the best video editor I tried, this bug prohibits me from using it for anything but very short clips :-(

I had attached dump of one of the occasions described above.

Revision history for this message
kultex (kult-ex-gmx) wrote :

same here - I use the latest version of AV-Linux Openshot 1.4.0

I used openshot the first time - I liked the result of rendering - I had to make a 11 min Clip with 3 Video files and 10 jpgs and some soundfiles.

there where two different crashes:

1) somehow the second core of my dual-core Athlon hangs on 2 GHZ - the first still goes down on 1 GHZ - very strange, this happens only with openshot - no other program - I could not continue working - only shut down the program and restart the computer. It happend only on watching the done work

2) when I got to the end, it started to crash when I did more than one change. But this was the real crash. like window away - openshot gone. The good thing was that I did not have to restart the computer. and it was really hard to finish the clip and get out the video

Revision history for this message
moimael (moimael) wrote :

You should try updating to mlt 0.7.8, a lot of crashes are fixed by this release, like thread locking and h264 issues. That's likely to fix your problem.

Revision history for this message
Bernd Faulstich (bernibaerchen) wrote :
Download full text (8.9 KiB)

i changed to Ubuntu 12.04 some weeks ago. I have more problems with rendering projects then ever. No rendering comes over 50%. Every time Errors of mp3 or missed frames. I thought it is temperature and dissembled my laptop, cleaned air pipes, fan and did fresh heat-contact-paste at the Grafic-Chip and CPU and got temperature down from 90 (average) to 65(maximum) °C. Problem still exist --> No thermal-problem.
I updated the software like described to PPT and added all the packages like mlt and so on. Tried after new updates again and again. Didn´t work.
If I start OpenShot from Commandline, with

root@abcde:~# openshot /media/Path/folder/Part2.osp

i get this output:

------------------------- ERROR 1 ------------------------------
Failed to import 'from openshot import main'
Error Message: cannot import name main
----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------
   OpenShot (version 1.4.2)
--------------------------------
Process no longer exists: 14051. Creating new pid lock file.
Adding files to the watch queue:
No LADSPA plugins were found!

Check your LADSPA_PATH environment variable.

Detecting formats, codecs, and filters...
---
video_codecs:
  - a64multi
  - a64multi5
<<many codecs>>
audio codecs
<<many codecs>>
formats
<<many formats>>
...
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
GenerateXML for an Effect
[mp3 @ 0xbfaabe0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xbfe93a0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xbfccfa0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xbfe92c0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xc019480] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xc04c020] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xc041360] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xc07b580] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xbfd8960] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xc0aa620] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xc0a44e0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xc0d9760] max_analyze_duration reached
project state modified
state saved
[mp3 @ 0xa8a88580] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0x90abe600] max_analyze_duration reached
NEW SDL CONSUMER
[mp3 @ 0xd966a60] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xd9a53e0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xd998b80] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xd9d89a0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xd9ce040] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xda07d00] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xd9d4440] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xda36f00] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xda33d20] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xda66040] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xd971260] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xda952e0] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xa8a8cc00] max_analyze_duration reached
[mp3 @ 0xa8a60e80] max_analyze_duration reached

Then i try to render the clip for WEB-VIMEOHD-25fps-medium
Output:

on_tlbMakeMovie_clicked called with self.GtkToolButton
on_cboExportType_changed
on_cboUploadServices_changed
on_cboProjectType_changed
on_cboExportTo_changed
on_btnExportVideo_clicked
NEW SDL CONSUMER
Genera...

Read more...

Revision history for this message
Andy Finch (fincha) wrote :

Maybe try transcoding to a different format before editing. It looks like ffmpeg is having problems with your files.

Revision history for this message
Olivier Girard (eolinwen) wrote :

Try to install ladpsa plugins like it is aksed even Openshot doesn't need of those. MLT has perhaps need of those.
See here the corresponding thread : http://forum.ubuntu-fr.org/viewtopic.php?id=834251
Shortly, because it is in French , here the good command line :
sudo apt-get install ladspa-sdk
Another thought : What version of ffmpeg are you using ?
More explanations here :
http://openshotusers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1261
http://openshotusers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1053

Revision history for this message
David Sowerby (david-sowerby) wrote :

I have problems very similar to those described in #24, with the same conclusion - OpenShot cannot be used for anything but simple tasks.

It appears that the crashes increase in frequency as the number of clips increases (as opposed to the length of clips). Usually it just shuts down, but on occasions forces a machine restart - a huge time waster.

The action sequence which most consistently cause a crash is:

1) edit / move a clip
2) click on the timeline play head

1) edit / move a clip
2) click 'go to start of timeline'
3) click on the timeline play head

Exporting a project and using that as an input to a new project also helps, which is why - apart from observation - I think it is related to the number of clips

Ubuntu 13.04 64 bit, OpenShot 1.4.3

Revision history for this message
madpentiste (antoine-messiah) wrote :

I had the same problem of frequent crashes with OpenShot 1.4.3 under Ubuntu 10.04 LTS 32bits :

1) Crashes associated with the autosave option (would crash after saving); solved by not using autosave.

2) Crashes associated with accumulation of actions that moves the playhead, whichever these actions are -- moving the playhead by hand, by jumps, by playing the project etc. No crashes associated with any other action.
Solved by upgrading to Ubuntu 12.04.4 LTS 32bits: the very same project that was started under 10.04 and would make OpenShot crash over and over, did not do so under 12.04.

NB: I had to duplicate the folder /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.7/openshot and rename the copy into /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/openshot in order to have a project started with 10.04 to be opened under 12.04 without the error message "the following transitions no longer exist", but this is another topic.

I hope these pieces of information can help.

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