Chinese language selection orders

[Abel Cheung]

The current setting for Chinese in language-selector can be improved,
since it is quite a special case. For rigorously definition, China language
settings can be divided into 5 districts. The settings below should
replace the original ones in /usr/share/language-selector/data/languagelist:

Chinese (China);0;zh;zh_CN.UTF-8;zh;CN;zh_CN:zh_CN.GB2312;
Chinese (Taiwan);0;zh;zh_TW.UTF-8;zh;TW;zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5;
Chinese (Hong Kong);0;zh;zh_HK.UTF-8;zh;HK;zh_HK:zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5;
Chinese (Singapore);0;zh;zh_SG.UTF-8;zh;SG;zh_SG:zh_CN:zh_CN.GB2312;
Chinese (Macau);0;zh;zh_MO.UTF-8;zh;MO;zh_MO:zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5:pt;

Macau has quite a perculiar setting due to its Portugal origin.

[Abel Cheung (abelcheung)]

Sorry, for Macau, far more people use English rather than Portugese now (according
to population census in 2001), the ratio is around 8:1 and still increasing. So the
correct entry for Macau is:

Chinese (Macau);0;zh;zh_MO.UTF-8;zh;MO;zh_MO:zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5;

[Colin Watson (cjwatson)]

Does this need to be changed in the installer (localechooser) too?

[Abel Cheung (abelcheung)]

Yes, otherwise users won't have correct setting out of box.
Besides, there is some amendment for the locale list above, in chinese districts the flavour of english learnt is British one, not American one.

Chinese (China);2;zh;zh_CN.UTF-8;zh;CN;zh_CN:zh_CN.GB2312:en_GB:en;
Chinese (Taiwan);2;zh;zh_TW.UTF-8;zh;TW;zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5:en_GB:en;
Chinese (Hong Kong);2;zh;zh_HK.UTF-8;zh;HK;zh_HK:zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5:en_GB:en; Chinese (Singapore);2;zh;zh_SG.UTF-8;zh;SG;zh_CN:zh_CN.GB2312:en_GB:en;
Chinese (Macau);2;zh;zh_MO.UTF-8;zh;MO;zh_HK:zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5:en_GB:en;

[Ming Hua (minghua)]

On Tue, Mar 07, 2006 at 11:22:44PM -0000, Abel Cheung wrote:
>
> Chinese (China);2;zh;zh_CN.UTF-8;zh;CN;zh_CN:zh_CN.GB2312:en_GB:en;
> Chinese (Taiwan);2;zh;zh_TW.UTF-8;zh;TW;zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5:en_GB:en;
> Chinese (Hong Kong);2;zh;zh_HK.UTF-8;zh;HK;zh_HK:zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5:en_GB:en;
> Chinese (Singapore);2;zh;zh_SG.UTF-8;zh;SG;zh_CN:zh_CN.GB2312:en_GB:en;
> Chinese (Macau);2;zh;zh_MO.UTF-8;zh;MO;zh_HK:zh_TW:zh_TW.Big5:en_GB:en;

I don't really understand the format here, but why (for example) both
zh_CN and zh_CN.GB2312 is listed in China's configuration here. In
Debian/Ubuntu the zh_CN locale uses GB2312 encoding, and strictly
speaking there is no zh_CN.GB2312 locale, just zh_CN (which uses
GB2312), zh_CN.GBK, zh_CN.GB18030, and zh_CN.UTF-8.

Ming
2006.03.07

[Abel Cheung (abelcheung)]

That field sets the $LANGUAGE variable. For legacy reason, some translation catalog files are still located in /usr/share/locale/zh_CN.GB2312/LC_MESSAGES (like gqview), that's why zh_CN.GB2312 has to be present. Most apps have migrated to zh_CN/LC_MESSAGES, but a few apps still haven't.

[Ming Hua (minghua)]

On Wed, Mar 08, 2006 at 02:23:40AM -0000, Abel Cheung wrote:
> Comment:
> That field sets the $LANGUAGE variable. For legacy reason, some
> translation catalog files are still located in
> /usr/share/locale/zh_CN.GB2312/LC_MESSAGES (like gqview), that's why
> zh_CN.GB2312 has to be present. Most apps have migrated to
> zh_CN/LC_MESSAGES, but a few apps still haven't.

I see, thanks for the explanation. I think I'll look around in the
archive for such kind of applications and patch them, so we can drop
this ugly zh_CN.GB2312 for dapper+1.

Ming
2006.03.07

[Matt Zimmerman (mdz)]

Colin, what needs to be done in order to effect the necessary changes in espresso? Does it use the same code from localechooser?

[Colin Watson (cjwatson)]

Yes, changing localechooser will be sufficient for both d-i and espresso.

[Matt Zimmerman (mdz)]

Targeting dapper.

Abel, can you confirm that the settings in language-selector are now correct? if so, those can be used as the basis for localechooser.

[Abel Cheung (abelcheung)]

Since there is no locale info for Macau, perhaps we can drop that single entry. If bug report is filed against apps that doesn't migrate translation and they are fixed, then $LANGUAGE part can be further simplified; otherwise the settings are correct.

[Matt Zimmerman (mdz)]

OK, there is only localechooser to do then

[Colin Watson (cjwatson)]

My remaining concern about this bug is this: is it OK to mention Taiwan in the installer? In the past, we have had considerable disagreement among Chinese speakers about whether Taiwan should be named or how it should be named, which is why the installer currently names the variants "Chinese (Simplified)" and "Chinese (Traditional)".

Is it OK to name Taiwan as long as we don't attempt to give it a full country name?

[Abel Cheung (abelcheung)]

Yes, I knew what happened with Debian. The point is: use geographical district name instead of country name, and everything would be fine. And it is necessary to move away from traditional/simplified, as it is no more effective to describe differences between various districts.

[Matt Zimmerman (mdz)]

Isn't the language in the installer already location-oriented rather than country-oriented? If so, it's fine to list Taiwan as a location.

[Colin Watson (cjwatson)]

I started looking at this. Wouldn't it be better to keep the existing languages offered by localechooser and instead offer an additional location choice? When selecting Chinese (Simplified), it would offer China or Singapore, and when selecting Chinese (Traditional), it would offer Hong Kong, Macau, or Taiwan. This would fit more neatly into how the installer works for other languages, and would avoid complications due to the installer not having translations for zh_HK, zh_MO, or zh_SG. The installer's internationalisation system doesn't support fallbacks in $LANGUAGE, so we have to be somewhat careful here.

If we do change languagelist, then languagelist.l10n needs to be changed too, which would require help from a native speaker: this contains native translations of each language offered by localechooser. At present we have:

Chinese (Traditional): 中文(繁體)
Chinese (Simplified): 中文(简体)

[huangdelin (zenmohuizheyang)]

How could I get the ubuntu install CDs?
我怎么得到ubuntu的安装光盘?

[Colin Watson (cjwatson)]

huangdelin, please see the Ubuntu web site or, failing that, ask in a more appropriate forum.

[Sam Cater (wraund-deactivatedaccount)]

is this bug still present in feisty?

[Boniek (boniek12p)]

We are closing this bug report because it lacks the information we need to investigate the problem, as described in the previous comments. Please reopen it if you can give us the missing information, and don't hesitate to submit bug reports in the future. To reopen the bug report you can click on the current status, under the Status column, and change the Status back to "New". Thanks again!