15.10 32 bit download gives error when run from usb

[Ilan Tal]

There seems to be a problem with the grub when trying to use 15.10, 32 bit downloaded from the official Ubuntu site.
The 64 bit version works fine.
If I take ubuntu-15.10-desktop-i386.iso and use it to define a new virtual machine in virtual box, again all works well.
Only if I use Startup disk creator to burn it to a usb disk on key there is a problem.
Instead of Try Ubuntu coming up I immediately get a boot error.

I tried downloading a second version of the iso and the problem repeated. Also if I download xubuntu-15.10-desktop-i386.iso the problem also appears.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

We will need the exact error message to have any idea what happened. Also is this a UEFI only machine?

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

Hi Philip,
Yesterday I tried again to download the latest 15.10 32 bit, just in case something might have changed. The error I get is simply "boot error".
As to the question if it is machine specific the answer is "no". I though something might be wrong with my disk on key so I took it to the store where I bought it. The person there got a boot error on his Windows machine. He said it was an iso error, but I asked him how could Ubuntu have such an error and not know about it?

I really needed to upgrade a machine my friend had with 13.10, so I burned a DVD. The DVD worked so I was able to get the job done but something is definitely wrong with the USB disk on key. I bought a second disk on key, one from ScanDisk and one from Transcend and both have the same problem.

Xubuntu 32 has the same problem but the 64 bit software works fine. This sounds crazy but there is something different about the 32 bit boot, ONLY on a usb disk on key.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

How are you setting up the usb stick? With the USB Creator in Ubuntu? Or some other way? Can you run md5sum on the .iso file?

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

I am using Startup Disk Creator, which I also used for the 64 bit edition. The 64 bit works fine. I get
7d483b990de4e1369b76b7b693737191 ubuntu-15.10-desktop-i386.iso

I used this iso to set up a VirtualBox machine and I also burned a DVD using it. The DVD worked fine.
The only thing which consistently doesn't work is the USB disk on key, using 2 different manufactures of the disk on key.
It gives a "boot error", which appears also in Xubuntu 32 bit iso.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

And when you created the virtual machine, did you select BIOS, or UEFI? Can you provide a screen shot of this message?

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

When I created the virtual machine I used the iso directly (there is an option to directly use an iso).
I can't provide any screen shots. I power down the machine, put in the USB disk on key and attempt to boot from it.
Very quickly it gives me the "boot error", and is stuck. I am not yet under control of any operating system.
I have passed BIOS but not by much.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

You should be able to take a screen shot using virtualbox. Also when you added the usb device to the virtual machine, did you add it as a cdrom or hard disk?

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

Hi Phillip,
You are mixing apples and oranges. Let me clarify. With the virtual machine I use the iso file directly - no problem there.

It is the boot from power off using a boot from a usb disk on key, where there is a problem. In that case it passes the BIOS and tries to boot. I just did it on my laptop and I can hand copy what is on the screen:

SYSLINUX 6.03 EDD 20150813 Copyright (C) 1194-2014 H. Peter Anvin et al
Boot error

I am not yet in any operating system, other than the BIOS which I just passed. What I expect to happen, if all would work, is that it go into a screen asking if I want to try Ubuntu or install Ubuntu.

BTW a friend has a machine with 2GB with no CD and the only way I can convert it to Ubuntu is with a disk on key, so it is fairly urgent. Also it isn't a great idea that the official Ubuntu software (32 bit) doesn't boot from a disk on key. The 64 bit version boots with no problem.

The second part of your question is irrelevant. No CD and no USB for making the virtual machine. The virtual machine came directly from the iso file - with no problems. I did this as a further check that the iso itself is OK. Just the boot when you do it from a power down state via usb, is there a real problem.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

When you "use the iso file directly" you attach it to the virtual machine either as a virtual hard disk, or a virtual cdrom. Either *should* work, but there are some important differences.

I suspect that the 32 bit image does not have a 32 bit grub boot loader listed in the cdrom el torito boot catalog ( this is actually a known issue ), and so it can't boot in UEFI mode. Syslinux is included in the image so that it can boot if used as a hard disk image, but if it is somehow being used by the bios when it thinks the drive is a cdrom instead, that could cause what you are seeing. If so, attaching the iso file as a virtual hard disk instead of a virtual cdrom should allow it to work.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

For what it's worth, I just tried the i386 image under a 32 bit qemu virtual machine and it booted just fine.

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

Virtual machines aren't really the problem. I didn't delve into it deeply, but one of the options is select an iso file. I just went to the Downloads folder and pointed to the 32 bit iso. Later on I see my disk listed as SATA which points to the vdi file and an IDE optical drive which would point to the iso file. (The actual optical is a SATA device, not IDE.)

If I look at the disk on key in BIOS I see it listed as a hard disk. I just give it top priority. How it REALLY works is beyond me.

What you are saying with this being a know issue, is there is absolutely nothing I can do about the problem? My friend who has no CD as part of the computer simply cannot use the 32 bit iso? I already put the 32 bit version on 2 computers with 2GB but both of them had CDs. You are saying I am dead in the water for the computer with no CD?

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

I'm saying it is a known issue that the 32 bit version can't be used in UEFI only machines. Works fine with conventional bios though.

I'm a bit confused now though.. I thought this was only an issue in a vm? Are you saying you can't get a real usb stick to work on real hardware? Is this hardware several years old?

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

I brought up the vm for the single reason to check the iso was OK. I was sure it was OK but another confirmation didn't hurt.

Yes, yes, the REAL problem is on real hardware. I can't find even one computer where the usb stick will work. I tried it originally on this machine which is less than 1 year old. I thought it was the stick itself so I went to the store where I bought it. The guy there got the same boot error on his machine and told me the iso was no good. I tried 3 more computers, from quite new to quite old and I couldn't get it to get past the boot error on any of them. Fortunately all of them had CD drives so I got around the problem by using a CD.

There is another computer which I would like to convert to Ubuntu and that one has no CD. It has 2GB memory which sort of asks for 32 bit, but since I could find even a single computer where the usb stick does work, I doubt it will work there either. My only choice is to use the 64 bit version, where the computer is a bit short on memory.

It isn't clear to me why the 64 bit boots fine and the 32 bit gives an error. Until a couple of years ago almost all of my machines were using 32 bit software and I never had any trouble then. Something went bad fairly recently and it is a real pity. Ubuntu is really great software (I've been using it for 10+ years), but the recent 32 bit is dead in the water for a usb stick.

Since it did work once, not too long ago, I would hope that someone would look into the problem and fix it. You should be able to duplicate the problem on your machine. If you have some magic where you can make it work, let me know. Maybe I can use the same magic to convert the machine with no CD drive.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

For what it is worth, the 64 bit version should be fine with 2g of ram.

How did you prepare the USB stick? With the USB startup disk creator, or with dd? Can you make sure the firmware is set to boot in legacy/bios mode, and NOT UEFI mode?

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

On my laptop I tried UEFI and BIOS. In UEFI it would not give an error - it would just ignore the usb stick and go directly into the usual Ubuntu. I take this to mean that in UEFI it is intelligent enough to know that something is wrong, but rather than giving an error, it just ignores the usb stick. In BIOS it always gives the "boot error".

Now on this machine I disabled the boot from UEFI and put the usb stick as the top priority disk. Now, here too it gives the "boot error" message. With 64 bit even the UEFI works properly.

Could you please try it on your machine and verify that it is indeed a problem. Otherwise the developers will reach the conclusion that I am doing something wrong and won't know there is a real problem. If Ubuntu posts the 32 bit version as a real option, it should work and not give boot errors. It isn't really fair to say "use the 64 bit version".

At this point the problem needs to reach the confirmed stage - or I need to know why it doesn't work for me on any machine I have tried to date.

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

I forgot to mention that I use startup disk creator. I don't know what dd is or how it is different from startup disk creator.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

We need to ascertain what is causing the problem first. Yes, the 32 bit install works fine for most people.

dd is a command to copy data around. Assuming the usb stick is /dev/sdb, you can use it to copy the iso image to the stick with:

sudo dd if=ubuntu-etc.iso of=/dev/sdb

Make sure it really *is* /dev/sdb before doing this, and note that this will wipe out all files on the usb stick, but this method may work for you. If it does, then it indicates there is something odd about your bios that is tripping up syslinux. If not, at least grub has a command line that we can use to further identify what is going wrong with your bios and see if it can be worked around.

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

Does the 32 usb stick boot correctly on your machine? I have been using the startup disk creator from day 1 since that is what is described in the help.
Upon thinking I have always used this particular machine to run the startup disk creator. It works fine for the 64 bit version. If you manage to make a 32 usb stick which boots correctly, I will try the startup disk creator on a number of other machines. I can also try the dd program to see if that is any different.

I am very surprised that it seems to work for most people. Why should my Ubuntu be different? First I need to know that it really works for you with a physical stick and a boot from power on.

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

I just did another experiment. There is something illogical about using this machine with 12GB to make a 32 bit stick, so I tried using Startup disk creator on a laptop with 32 bit Ubuntu. This one I updated using a DVD with 15.10 32 bit. Exactly the same problem comes up: from a power off a boot from the physical usb stick gives a boot error.
So it isn't this particular machine has a problem making the stick. Even a machine with 2GB and a 32 bit system has the same problem. I am very surprised that you can't duplicate it on your machine.

Now I will try dd, which I have never used. We need to nail down if the problem is in the iso or in the program which writes it to the stick.

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

Finally, finally, some progress. The startup disk creator fails for 32 but 15.10 but dd works!
I can finally produce a usb stick which works.

If you can confirm the problem on your machine then we can assign the problem to startup disk creator. From my point of view dd gives me a solution I can live with.

Is there a way we can compare the 2 sticks, to see exactly which byte is wrong?

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

I tried to reproduce this using the usb startup disk creator in 15.10 and can't because it seems that it is completely fubar. I will file a separate bug report for the issues I ran into since you did not, but it seems that your issue is a result of the usb-creator. For me, it claimed it failed to install the boot loader on the usb stick.

[Phillip Susi (psusi)]

I think this is the same issue as another one I just found so marking as a duplicate. If you think otherwise, feel free to unmark it and I'll try to help troubleshoot.

[Ilan Tal (ilan-tal)]

There is still a problem. The original bug reports 64 bit. The bug is marked as resolved. It is indeed resolved for 64 bit but very much unresolved for 32 bit. Since 32 bit is part of the official Ubuntu release, it should be looked into and fixed. I don't know how to change the status, so you will need to do that for me.

There is one thing you need to know. On this machine if I use UEFI I will not see any error message. It will just ignore the stick. (The problem isn't solved, just invisible.) You need to tell it not to use UEFI and then the boot error will appear.