Can't see details/descriptions of updates anymore

[Trouilliez vincent]

When you run the update manager, and it finds some packages that needs updating,
you used to be able to click on them, and see, at the bottom of the window, a
description of what a particular package does, by clicking the little arrow at
below the list.
Clicking the arrow now doesn't show any details anymore.

Screenshot attached : arrow is clicked/pointing down, but no detail is given,
not even an empty text box, nothing.

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

Created an attachment (id=1427)
Description area is missing

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

Thanks for your bugreport.

I don't see this behaviour on my machine. Does it always happen for you? Or only
sometimes?

Thanks,
 Michael

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

> I don't see this behaviour on my machine. Does it always happen for you? Or
only sometimes?

It started happening 2 or 3 days ago after an update (I update several times a
day), and would show the problem each and every time.
But not too worry anymore, as it seems to have just cured itself !
I just ran thez update manager again, and saw that there was an update for
Synaptic. Not the update manager mind you, but I assumed that the Update manager
relied heaviliy on Synpatic, so I was hoping for the best.
And I was lucky indeed. I updated Synpatic, and now, the update manager appears
to work fine again, it shows me all the details of each package ! Go figure...

I will keep an eye on it though, in case it starts doibng it again ;o)

Okay, bug closed, on to the next now ;o)

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

I close this bug if the problems is now gone :) Please reopen if you see it again.

Cheers,
 Michael

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

> I close this bug if the problems is now gone :) Please reopen if you see it again.

Hi Mike,

I don't understand, this bug is back again ! Then it was fixed again, all in one
day !
It's strange. Today I updated Hoary, and the bug was back again. Then two hours
later, I updated again, which included a package for synaptic or the
update-manager (can't remember which), which cured the problem. Then later, I
updated again, and there were no package related to Synatic or the update
manager, and the bug was back AGAIN !!!!

It looks like as soon as the update does not contain synaptic or update-manager
related packages, it "triggers" the bug. And as soon as the updates contain some
package related to Synaptic or the upgdate-manager, things are back normal.

Next time the bug appears, I will try re-installing the update-manager from
Synaptic, see if that fixes it.

--
Vince

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

I think this problem is fixed in my current source repostiory. It will be part
of the next upload.

Cheers,
 Michael

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

> I think this problem is fixed in my current source repostiory. It will be part
of the next upload.

Hmmmm... it keeps doing it ! It's really funny (kind of ! ;o), it seems to be
doing it in a "cylcic" way : does it, next time it doens't do it, then next
update it does it again, etc. It never does it twice in a row, it's always one
time with, and the next time without.
Anyway, today it did it again. So before installing the updates, I closed the
update-manager, opened synpatic and re-installed the "update-manager" package.
The I restarted the update-manager and oh miracle, it was fixed !!! Maybe
that's clue ? What did re-installing the update-manager possibly do ?

--
Vince

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

Update ! In fact, turns out I don't actually need to re-install the update
manager at all.
I tried to just restart it, and it fixes the problem !
Everytime I can't see the descriptions, I just have to exit, srestart it, and
all by magic, the description tabs reappear !

Strange......

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

Thanks for your comments. Thew new version is not uploaded yet (and will not
before preview). You can get a updated deb at:
http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/review/update-manager/update-manager_0.37.1+svn20050304_i386.deb

Please install it with:
$ sudo dpkg -i update-manager_0.37.1+svn20050304_i386.deb
and tell me if it fixes the problem (it should :)

Thanks,
 Michael

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

> Please install it with: $ sudo dpkg -i update-manager_0.37.1+svn20050304_i386.deb
> and tell me if it fixes the problem (it should :)

Huuu.... hum hum !! I installed it, and it crashes as soon as it opens up !!!

Here is the output in the terminal window :

********
vincent@Lotus-Esprit:~/Desktop$ sudo update-manager
Reading Package Lists... Done
Building Dependency Tree... Done
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 764, in ?
    updatemanager.main()
  File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 740, in main
    self.fillstore()
  File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 579, in fillstore
    self.initCache()
  File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 717, in initCache
    self.depcache.ReadPinFile()
AttributeError: ReadPinFile
Unhandled exception in thread started by
Error in sys.excepthook:

Original exception was:
vincent@Lotus-Esprit:~/Desktop$
********

--
Vince

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

(In reply to comment #10)
> > Please install it with: $ sudo dpkg -i
update-manager_0.37.1+svn20050304_i386.deb
> > and tell me if it fixes the problem (it should :)
>
> Huuu.... hum hum !! I installed it, and it crashes as soon as it opens up !!!
>
> Here is the output in the terminal window :
>
> ********
> vincent@Lotus-Esprit:~/Desktop$ sudo update-manager
> Reading Package Lists... Done
> Building Dependency Tree... Done
> Traceback (most recent call last):
> File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 764, in ?
> updatemanager.main()
> File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 740, in main
> self.fillstore()
> File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 579, in fillstore
> self.initCache()
> File "/usr/bin/update-manager", line 717, in initCache
> self.depcache.ReadPinFile()
> AttributeError: ReadPinFile
> Unhandled exception in thread started by
> Error in sys.excepthook:
>
> Original exception was:
> vincent@Lotus-Esprit:~/Desktop$

Ups, sorry. You need a updated python-apt for this. Get it from:
http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/review/python-apt/python-apt_0.5.37_i386.deb

(sorry for the trouble).

Cheers,
 Michael

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

> Ups, sorry. You need a updated python-apt for this. Get it from:
> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/review/python-apt/python-apt_0.5.37_i386.deb

Thanks, it doesn't crash any more now. But I get an error window (see
attachment) saying that some packages can't be upgraded. It doesn't look very
serious, but the thing is, I did NOT get this error when I tried with the
previous version of the update-manager, only 3 minutes ago... or does that mean
that the packages got broken in this narrow 3 minute time window ??

--
Vince

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

Created an attachment (id=1539)
Error message

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

I un-installed and re-installed this 20050304 version, to compare with the
version I had beforte (20050301), and no doubt, the error message really only
come up with this latest version, not the old one. So I will re-install the old
one so that I can update...

--
Vince

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

Oh, I also get another error message when I exit this last version of the
update-manager, see screenshot ! :-/
It says "Child terminated with 161 status" I don't understand : I have no kids
!! :-O ;o)

--
Vince

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

Created an attachment (id=1540)
Error message whenb exiting

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

(In reply to comment #14)
> I un-installed and re-installed this 20050304 version, to compare with the
> version I had beforte (20050301), and no doubt, the error message really only
> come up with this latest version, not the old one. So I will re-install the old
> one so that I can update...

This warning message is a new feature of the code :) The old version has the
same problem, but it does not tell the user about it. The problem is that
update-manager is designed as a updater for a stable system. Therefore it tries
to be as conservative as possible and it will not remove or install software (it
will only update it). Sometimes it's nescessary to remove or install something
to satisfy a dependency and this is now detected and warned about. Do you think
the message could be written cleaner to tell the user that it's not a fatal
problem ?

Cheers,
 Michael

[Trouilliez vincent (vincent-trouilliez-modulonet)]

> This warning message is a new feature of the code :) The old version has the
> same problem, but it does not tell the user about it. The problem is that
> update-manager is designed as a updater for a stable system. Therefore it tries
> to be as conservative as possible and it will not remove or install software (it
> will only update it). Sometimes it's nescessary to remove or install something
> to satisfy a dependency and this is now detected and warned about. Do you think
> the message could be written cleaner to tell the user that it's not a fatal
> problem ?

Hi Mike, sorry, been out all day ! ;-)

Okay I understand better now ! ;o)
Yes, I think the dialog should be redesigned, it basically scared the shit out
of me. It really makes it look like there is something SERIOUSLY wrong, that
Ubuntu is about to die as soon as you hit the Okay button. I think it needs to
be simpler, or using terms that make more sense to joe public and also, try not
to make it look like the system is about to explode or something. User need to
be informed of what's going on, but need not panic !

But the dialog asks the user to do a dist-upgrade, which will install or remove
the pacakges anyway. Joe public is not in a position to judge if adding or
removing package "blahblah" is good or bad. He will just think" it a security
fix, it's important, I must install it. If I must click her eor there to let the
update-manager to upgrade properly, then I will do of course".
So I think the update manager should not ask the user to run a dist-upgrade
himslef. this is way too technical, and unnecessary. I think the dialog should
just say:

 "I inform you that this particular security fix requires to install packages
xxx and removed packages zzz. This is nothing to worry about and you should just
click 'okay' to carry on updating. If however you know better than me, and have
reasons to believe I should not remove or add these packages, please feel free
to abort the installation of this security fix by clicing on the 'abort' button
below. "

Something like that ! ;o)

BTW, I cna't see the update-manager icon, in the notification area in gnome's
top panel, where is it ? I just read that today there are a bunch of packages
due to the releases of gnome 2.10, so I was kinda expecting to see the icon to
show up there ! :-/

--
Vince

[Michael Vogt (mvo)]

(In reply to comment #18)
> Okay I understand better now ! ;o)
> Yes, I think the dialog should be redesigned, it basically scared the shit out
> of me. It really makes it look like there is something SERIOUSLY wrong, that
> Ubuntu is about to die as soon as you hit the Okay button. I think it needs to
> be simpler, or using terms that make more sense to joe public and also, try not
> to make it look like the system is about to explode or something. User need to
> be informed of what's going on, but need not panic !

I changed the type from WARNING to INFO. This should make it look less scary :)

> But the dialog asks the user to do a dist-upgrade, which will install or remove
> the pacakges anyway. Joe public is not in a position to judge if adding or
> removing package "blahblah" is good or bad. He will just think" it a security
> fix, it's important, I must install it. If I must click her eor there to let the
> update-manager to upgrade properly, then I will do of course".
> So I think the update manager should not ask the user to run a dist-upgrade
> himslef. this is way too technical, and unnecessary. I think the dialog should
> just say:
>
> "I inform you that this particular security fix requires to install packages
> xxx and removed packages zzz. This is nothing to worry about and you should just
> click 'okay' to carry on updating. If however you know better than me, and have
> reasons to believe I should not remove or add these packages, please feel free
> to abort the installation of this security fix by clicing on the 'abort' button
> below. "
>
> Something like that ! ;o)

Thanks for this idea.

We'll fix that for hoary+1. Normal users will never see it anyway. Ubuntu/stable
will
never require a add/remove for a update. It's only for people that track unstable or
run external repositories. I fell really unconfortable with changing the logic of
udpate-manager so that it can do more than normal upgrades (at this stage of the
release).

> BTW, I cna't see the update-manager icon, in the notification area in gnome's
> top panel, where is it ? I just read that today there are a bunch of packages
> due to the releases of gnome 2.10, so I was kinda expecting to see the icon to
> show up there ! :-/

Is "update-notifier" runing? You can check with the process viewer. If so, you
should see the icon. If you don't see it, it's probably a bug that you want to
report :)

Cheers,
 Michael

P.S. I close the bugreport now as the original bug is fixed in current hoary and
the dialog
has changed (a bit) too. Feel free to reopen if you are unhappy with that.

[David M. Karr (davidmichaelkarr)]

It seems pretty odd that I'm reporting a bug that was apparently fixed many years ago, but the description of the original report matches pretty closely to what I'm seeing.

The Update Manager renders a row for each package being updated, with a little black right-pointing arrow, making it seem like I could click on the arrow to expand it, but clicking the arrow does nothing. If I double-click it, it just unchecks the checkbox (for installing it).

I've been using Ubuntu for a while (but not quite as long as the original reporter), and I know this used to work, even within the last year.